Episode 183

Unlocking Potential: The Power of Boredom & Inner Growth

Published on: 15th October, 2025

Whiskey Chats & Deep Conversations: The Journey of Growth and Self-Discovery

In this heartfelt and engaging episode of the Whiskey & Wisdom Podcast, co-hosts Tyler and Chris welcome back special guests Mike Rokoski and Kathryn Bruner, joining for the fourth or fifth time but drinking whiskey on the podcast for the first time, dives into a barrel pick of Weller foolproof. The group delves into discussions about their favorite whiskeys, with shoutouts to local enthusiasts and in-depth tasting notes. They transition seamlessly into more profound conversations about personal growth, the importance of being present, and the impacts of social media. Reflections on the balance between masculinity and femininity, the inspirations drawn from historical and biblical figures, and the significance of boredom and creativity highlight their evolved perspectives. The episode also touches on travel stories, the significance of true connections, and the guests' future projects. Join them for a delightful mix of whiskey wisdom and thought-provoking dialogue.


00:00 Introduction and Guest Welcome

00:39 Whiskey Tasting and Discussion

02:30 Square Glasses vs. Round Glasses

03:22 Favorite Whiskeys and Past Episodes

05:21 Wine Tasting in Italy

08:44 Art and Personal Development

13:12 Leadership and Personal Growth

24:34 Local Impact and Self-Accountability

30:45 Bonsai Trees and Personal Growth

32:10 The Impact of Social Media on Our Lives

32:38 The Importance of Authenticity and Candor

33:46 Personal Growth Through Relationships

36:57 Redefining Masculinity and Femininity

43:15 The Dangers of Social Media Addiction

51:26 Finding Joy in Boredom and Creativity

56:10 The Value of Presence and Mindfulness

59:27 Reflections on Success and Personal Growth

Transcript
Tyler:

Welcome back to the Whiskey Muslim Podcast everyone.

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This is your co-host, Tyler, y'all.

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And today I am with Chris Lum

and our two special guests are

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Mike: Mike Koski

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Tyler: and

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Mike: Catherine Brener.

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Tyler: And you may recognize both of them,

especially Catherine, 'cause I think this

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is like the fourth or maybe even fifth

time that you've been on the podcast.

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And as we discussed previously,

even though she's been on multiple

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times, this is the first time she's

actually drinking on our podcast.

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I'm so proud.

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Same

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Mike: with Mike.

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Same with Mike.

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Tyler: You didn't drink on the last one,

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Chris: right?

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Mike: Yeah, that's right.

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The the first one I did with you

guys, I was doing 75 hard at the time.

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And so I was trying to be incredibly

disciplined and didn't even take a sip.

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That will not be the case today.

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Mm-hmm.

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Hey, let's

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Chris: go.

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So talking about whiskeys

that we're drinking.

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So we got Weller foolproof and this is a

barrel select shout out to Matt Costin.

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He runs a pretty sick Instagram.

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I think it's Wilmington realtor.

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But I'll double check.

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But he always posts really cool stuff

around town events and gets people

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involved, which is pretty cool.

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He went out and did a barrel pick.

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So that's what we're trying.

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Typical foolproof.

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For those who want the background

Weller falls into Buffalo Trace Family

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it's a little bit different 'cause

this one is more wheat than rye.

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So that's for you, Tyler.

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Ooh.

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And most of these are bottled

at 114 proof, but didn't

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Tyler: taste that hot

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Chris: when I tried

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Tyler: it.

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Chris: Hey, I'm just telling,

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Kathryn: I was being

polite and waiting him.

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Chris: Someone disciplined over here.

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So it's supposed to be a balance

of rich mouth feel with a ose,

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robust notes of vanilla and oak.

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And then it's a non

chill, filtered whiskey.

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Very, very classic.

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And then tasting notes.

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You'll have vanilla and dark

cherries with caramel on the nose.

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And then you should have a balance of

caramel and toasted oak with a creme

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brulee and kind of chocolate finish.

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But because this is a barrel

pick, it's gonna be a little

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bit different flavor wise too.

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So shout out to the whiskey lovers.

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I'm gonna be different and be neat.

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I like it.

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Yeah.

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Cheers.

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Cheers.

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Cheers.

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Tyler: Ooh, that smells good.

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Mike: Mm-hmm.

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That's tasty.

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Tyler: Yeah.

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Kathryn: This is so smooth.

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Tyler: The caramel and the oak.

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I get a lot of Yeah.

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Upfront.

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Thank you for

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Kathryn: making this

whiskey and wisdom 'cause

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Tyler: Oh, exactly.

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Geez.

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Something to make it fun.

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We're not sure where this

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Mike: podcast is going, but

you got the first half of the

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podcast versus the whiskey down.

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Chris: So gonna start off real silly.

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How do you guys feel about square

glasses drinking out of versus round?

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Kathryn: It depends on what

I'm drinking out of it.

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Chris: So, with whiskey, like

how do you drink out of this?

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Well, I feel like that's, do

you drink flat side or corner?

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Kathryn: No, I'm, I'm a both.

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I gotta mix it up, but I feel

like my ice fits in here better.

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This cup was made from my ice.

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Tyler: So here's the fun

thing about these glasses.

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So, okay.

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The real way you drink out of

these glasses is there's actually

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a half cube that fits in here that

fills up half the whole glass.

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We have

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Kathryn: one.

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Tyler: Yeah.

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Yeah.

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And so when I'm drinking it

like that, I have to drink outta

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the corner just because with.

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Yep.

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With the pinky.

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I just told him French this

morning and the same thing.

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Well, there we go.

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We're on the same, same page there.

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But like this, I can just

drink it like a normal

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Mike: Oh, I think your first one out of a

square glass is easy, but if you have more

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than one, it might be a little difficult.

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Tyler: Yeah, that's probably true.

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Chris: It's been a while.

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Haven't drank with you or you, what

has been your favorite whiskey?

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Mike: Probably Blanton's.

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Chris: Just classic Blands.

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Mike: Classic Blands.

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Okay.

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Just so consistent, so tasty.

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I like that one a lot.

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If I had to pick one.

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Chris: Okay.

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It's the only time I've

had Blands is with Palmer.

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Tyler: Oh yeah, that's right.

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Chris: We had an episode with

Palmer that didn't make it.

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Yep.

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I don't remember why

I wanna say something.

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Some of the sound or something

was messed up and I was like, this

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is the one time I've had blends.

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It was pretty good though.

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Yeah.

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What about you,

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Kathryn: Kentucky?

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I'll not confiscated.

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Mm-hmm.

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Bash 10.

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It just, it tastes like caramel.

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It's smooth.

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It's just, it's so easy to drink.

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What

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Tyler: you can go online

if it hasn't sold out yet.

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I just thought about it right now.

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The mid winners, Dr.

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Has dropped today, so if you're

into that, you can order that.

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So if you're listening to it

now, sorry, it's probably gone.

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That's what, yeah, it's,

it's from High West.

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It's a mid winter's Dr.

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Yeah.

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I think it's, I do like

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Mike: their smoked they have a campfire.

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Yeah, the High West Campfire

in the middle of winter.

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Oh yes.

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Mm-hmm.

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It's a great, great drink.

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Chris: See, we were talking about

this, so would you guys be interested

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to a podcast episode where we just

talk about like seasonal whiskeys that

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we like or like our top rated ones?

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Mike: Yeah, I probably would.

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What about you?

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Probably

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Kathryn: I'll drink it 'cause

it's pretty and it tastes good.

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But anything beyond that,

I'm kind of like me.

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But now if we talked about

wine, I would nerd out.

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I was about to say, so I can

respect the people that like

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the whiskey, the W alcohol.

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Yes, exactly.

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I would nerd out all day.

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Well actually would be kind of

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Mike: an interesting podcast modification

where you did it's whiskey and wine.

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Mm.

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Mm-hmm.

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And we're gonna try to impart some wisdom.

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Yeah.

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And that would be kind of

interesting to be able to, to do,

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to do a combined whiskey and wine.

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That would be interesting.

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Yeah.

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I've gotten, I could bring you guys

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Tyler: back on.

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Yeah.

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I've gotten deep in that, well,

especially since we've been to

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Mike: Italy for her birthday

with our significant others and.

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Been to Tuscany and, and drinking wine.

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We brought so much wine

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Kathryn: home and now when we go

to local restaurants, we bring

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our own bottle and we just pay the

breakage fee just to have good wine.

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Tyler: I didn't know that was an option.

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Can't really get in the US

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Kathryn: Yeah, no, but we drank an

unreasonable amount of wine when

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we were there and we were fine.

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Tyler: Oh, great.

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So I've heard a lot of people

say too, just because it doesn't

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have all the additives and

preservatives and everything else.

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And

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Kathryn: Well, one day we ended up

splitting and going separate ways.

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We had met in Florence, we

went to a wine resort there

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and did a full day experience.

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And then they Mike and Stephanie went

one place, and then Alan and I went

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towards the coastal side of Tuscany

and went to a different wine resort.

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And when we got there, the

in the morning, we did like a

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breakfast wine tasting mm-hmm.

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With different meals.

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And then we did a massage and

they had given us wine and then

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we had like a five course lunch.

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And long story short, by the time we

were at our like dessert, at the end

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of the day, we'd probably consumed four

bottles of wine between the two of us.

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Like, or more, or maybe each.

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Yeah.

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I don't know.

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We don't remember, but we were fine

and we woke up the next morning

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and like we went for a hike and

we had energy and we slept well.

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And that is not the case

here in America at all.

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That's amazing.

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And I ate pasta and pizza the whole time

and my jeans fit the same when I left.

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Mike: It was great.

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Actually.

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I went home, I think I weighed two

pounds less than when I left for Italy.

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Eating and drinking that way,

which is a statement to kind of

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the corruptness of the FDA here.

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Mm-hmm.

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And what we allow in

our foods, in our drink.

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Et cetera.

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It's, it's it's a sad statement.

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Kathryn: Well, and we were, if

that's the case, gluttonous, I

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mean, we landed in Paris and then.

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The first flight that Mike and

Stephanie took, got delayed.

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You guys had to catch a train

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Mike: Oh, wow.

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Kathryn: Or something

to get back to Florence.

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Remember?

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'cause the wind,

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Mike: we did, we, we we actually had

to fly into Pisa where the leaning

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tower is because the winds were

too strong and take a train back.

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And then you guys, your

flight was delayed.

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Mm-hmm.

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But you were delayed enough, the

winds died down so they could

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fly straight into Florence.

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But we got there about the

same time it worked out.

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They were

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Kathryn: shopping and then we

walked down the street and met them.

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We went into a restaurant and we

ordered, we ordered everything.

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We ordered pizza, we ordered

pasta, we ordered steak.

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We ordered like everybody

had two entrees basically.

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And then we went, we had wine there

and then we went across the street.

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We bought a bottle of wine, we went

down the street, got gelato and

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then we went and sat in like it was

dark outside at the statue of David.

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That's so amazing.

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Replica, right?

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Yeah.

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And just, just drank straight outta

the bottle, pass it back and forth.

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And so we were eating gelato.

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That's awesome.

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Like in the little piazza just out there.

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It's hard to beat that.

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Mike: That's prototypical.

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What you would think Italy

is, was exactly what it was.

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That's awesome.

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Chris: So wait, where

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Mike: multi questions.

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Where's the real statue of David?

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The real statue of David

is in a museum in Florence.

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Mm-hmm.

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Okay.

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And they put a replica because

vandals would like, there's

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actually part of the toe mm-hmm.

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Is chunked out because somebody

took a sledgehammer to it.

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And so they put it within

the museum, the academe.

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Mm-hmm.

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And and it's under, under, you

have to go through surveillance

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and all of that to protect it along

with a bunch of other sculptures.

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So the statue of David that's in

the, in the courtyard is a replica.

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Replica.

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Okay.

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Interesting.

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Chris: Which reminds me, I said this

at one point, we were watching Top

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Chef because I love watching people

cook, even though it's not me.

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And they did the finals for last season.

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They went to Italy and

they allowed them to sit.

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In a museum and it actually had the

original painting of the Last Supper.

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Kathryn: Mm.

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Chris: First off, super sick.

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I was like, got emotional.

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Yeah.

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I was like, that's awesome.

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But I didn't realize how big it was.

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Kathryn: Oh yeah.

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Mm-hmm.

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Chris: Like the people were sitting

down looking up at this thing and

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all of the people were life-size.

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And I was like, 'cause all

you see typically is like on

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a photo or somewhere else.

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And I was like, someone sat and

painted a life-sized mural with 13

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people with the full background.

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Like the, I've kind of sad that

artistry has kind of shrunken itself

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to fit within like our capsules, which

is like cell phones or like on a tv.

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So you don't get that full

scale that you used to.

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So I, I'm kind of salty that,

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Kathryn: well, obviously you grew

up as much older than our country.

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Yes.

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And so a lot of the artwork over

there is that way, like it was

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their life, this expression.

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Mm-hmm.

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It wasn't just, Hey, I'm gonna

make some money off of this.

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I'm seeking material value from this.

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It's, this is my soul being

poured into something.

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And there wasn't enough

space for it to take up.

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They didn't think about it as,

everyone's gonna like this.

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They thought about it as, what

can I give, what can I do?

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There's more passion behind it.

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Mm-hmm.

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Mike: Well, it's, it's fascinating

you talk about that and it's, it's

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so embodied in, in those days of

Michelangelo and DaVinci and all of those

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Michelangelo, there were no female actors.

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They were not allowed.

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And they actually would self castrate

to start to have female features.

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So that they could play the roles

of female as a male because females

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weren't allowed all experience.

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So you're talk about the passionate Yeah.

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The passion in that artistry.

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I mean, wow.

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Yeah.

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I mean, and, and talk about David.

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I have such a passion for

David and the life of David.

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So we usually talk personal development.

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So I'll jump in on David and

why it fascinates me so much.

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So, when you think about the statue

of David and when Michelangelo chose

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to depict him, at what stage in my,

in David's life, was it, you know,

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is it right after he slayed Goliath

as after he was crown king of Israel?

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Is it, you know, all of these

accomplishments that David had in his

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life and Michelangelo chose to depict

him and he has the stone in his hand and

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the slingshot with the satchel around

him getting ready to slay Goliath.

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And for me, the meaning in that is, is.

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In the moment of decision.

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Kathryn: Mm-hmm.

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Mike: He's not portrayed in that statue,

which is world famous after conquering.

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He's not portrayed after becoming king.

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He's portrayed in his moment

of decision to follow the path

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that God laid out for his life.

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And I, I feel so strongly about it.

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I'm doing a study of David and

ultimately I plan on writing a

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book called The Moment of Decision.

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And what are the moments of decision

in our lives that we have, we have had,

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right, there's moments of decision.

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We said, we know that our family

loves us, but they're probably holding

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us back, so we need to break free.

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I had that moment of decision the moment

of decision with your significant other.

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Some of us, it's the moment of

decision to leave that significant

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other and to move forward.

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But it's fascinating to think about

the fact that that was the moment that

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Michelangelo chose to depict David.

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I just find that really fascinating.

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Tyler: Something I like about that too,

because I, I heard that story as well.

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And so to put a, like a faith spin on

it too, is when he made that decision,

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people were like, he was so young, he had

no experience, but at that point he had

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already been anointed by God to be king.

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So that's the difference of fighting

for victory and fighting from victory.

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He had already won.

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God had already crowned him King.

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He knew he was gonna be king of

Israel, so he knew even standing

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up in front of Goliath, he was

fighting from victory already.

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He knew he had already

run, won before he started.

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Kathryn: I love how much

this came from your heart.

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You can see in the way

that you're expressing it.

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Mm-hmm.

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Tyler: I just went through something like

learning about that like two weeks ago.

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So that's why.

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Yeah.

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Mike: Well, and, and, and, and the other

thing is how often when, when someone that

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loves you, and I remember the first time

we met that caused the first podcast, I

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said, who's loving you into a lower level?

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Mm-hmm.

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Mm-hmm.

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But, but in, when you're going

into a battle, who's trying

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to equip you with their armor?

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That really will drag you down, right?

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Yeah.

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Saul wanted to give David his armor.

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Mm-hmm.

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Which would, he would've lost.

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He was mm-hmm.

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Not able to do it.

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It was his sword, it was his armor.

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And you know, how often do we

not have the fortitude to look at

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someone and say, I don't need your

armor for this battle of my life.

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Kathryn: Mm-hmm.

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Mike: And fortunately David knew that and

didn't use Saul's armor for that battle.

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So I think that's also a kind of

an, an interesting, well, I think

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Kathryn: sometimes the person

that's loving us into a low,

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lower level isn't a person.

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It's our society.

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And the way that we've been

programmed into, you know, you

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have to do more, you have to win.

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You have to get the biggest like job

in the nicest car and all these things.

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And we're all running towards

these huge goals rather than

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loving the work that's behind them.

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Because a lot of people, especially really

successful people, I'm sure you can speak

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to this, that you've probably reached

some ob seen goal that the 13-year-old

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version of you couldn't even dreamed of.

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But then after it happened,

you're just like, what's next?

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Mm-hmm.

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Like, how can I keep running?

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What can I do?

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And you might be different in that

way, but for me that was one of the

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things that I always realized is that

I was always chasing what's next?

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What can I do?

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How can there I find more?

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And it was actually I read it

probably seven to 10 years ago

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when Mark Manson's book came out.

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But that was one of the things

that he talked about is that

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you have to love the struggle.

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And our culture doesn't teach that.

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Tyler: No.

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I was actually talking about exactly

what you just said yesterday.

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And I had a goal in my mind

from when I was like 15.

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And for some reason, like while I was

going through high school, while I was

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going through college, I always kept

that same goal and I never adjusted

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it to where I thought I could go.

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So I ended up hitting

that goal when I was 27.

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:

And then I actually went in kind

of like a depression for a year

412

:

because I was like, now what?

413

:

This is everything that I wanted.

414

:

Yeah.

415

:

I was like, now what?

416

:

What do I do now?

417

:

Just because like I always have

like that go-getter attitude.

418

:

I want to go on to the next thing and I

didn't know where that goal needed to be

419

:

or how to shift or how to make a new goal.

420

:

'cause I hadn't made one for so long and

I didn't have that part of my practice.

421

:

So now part of the practice is

always revisiting that goal and

422

:

like, Hey, where am I on this?

423

:

Where am I gonna go next?

424

:

So just always having that practice to

going back and revisiting it and not just

425

:

set one goal and like forget about it.

426

:

Kathryn: Well, that's the perfect

example for relationships.

427

:

Mm-hmm.

428

:

So many people are like, I'll be

happy when I find my perfect person.

429

:

But are you the perfect version

of yourself to attract that?

430

:

And then once you're in it, it's not about

who's gonna make me happy, it's who are

431

:

you willing to struggle through life with?

432

:

Mm-hmm.

433

:

Who is really good at

problem solving with you?

434

:

Who is really good at

communicating with you?

435

:

'cause life's not easy.

436

:

Right.

437

:

And I think people think that they can

take a magic pill to lose weight instead

438

:

of grinding in the gym, which clearly

you have been since the last time I

439

:

saw you in such a tattoo you earlier.

440

:

But there's any form of success.

441

:

Any person that's achieved anything,

they'll tell you that it's a mountain.

442

:

And if you're not willing to climb,

like there's no happiness at base camp,

443

:

you're just gonna be miserable looking

up at the sky, and you have to figure

444

:

out what you're willing to work hard for.

445

:

Mm-hmm.

446

:

Mike: Well, I think in that the,

I love the climbing the mountain

447

:

analogy because I think when you can

get to the point where the climb is

448

:

actually more enjoyable to you Exactly.

449

:

Than reaching the peak.

450

:

That's

451

:

Kathryn: the point.

452

:

Yeah.

453

:

And when

454

:

Mike: you get to the climb and you

get to decide to go to the next peak,

455

:

you're kind of jazzed up about it.

456

:

I think when the.

457

:

It, it took me a long time to,

I enjoy the journey now more

458

:

than any potential destination.

459

:

Yeah.

460

:

Mm-hmm.

461

:

A hundred percent.

462

:

And it, it's really it's wonderful.

463

:

And you talk about relationships, you

know, I really think and, and talk about

464

:

fitness and relationships and I really

think it took me a long time to learn.

465

:

I think, I think every interaction

you have with someone is very

466

:

much like a bank account.

467

:

Every time you interact, you're gonna make

a deposit or you're gonna make a withdraw.

468

:

Mm-hmm.

469

:

Yep.

470

:

And it's, you know, we

try to complicate things.

471

:

I, I always joke when you know

you're in the investment business,

472

:

if someone sends me something to

analyze, that's an investment.

473

:

I always tell them, do not

send me math with letters.

474

:

'cause you can use letters

to manipulate anything.

475

:

Anything to make a return look fantastic.

476

:

And we try to over complicate.

477

:

Like dieting, you know?

478

:

Mm-hmm.

479

:

But at the end of the

day, it's simple math.

480

:

You're either making

a deposit or withdraw.

481

:

If you're consuming more calories than

you burn in a day, you're gaining weight.

482

:

If you consume less,

you're gonna lose weight.

483

:

Now you gotta layer in, you can't

eat all your calories with cake,

484

:

but, but at the same time, every

relationship you're making a deposit

485

:

or a withdrawal in every interaction.

486

:

And if the account's overdrawn

too long, the relationship ends.

487

:

And if you have a massive credit

balance, you have an opportunity to,

488

:

to ha go through some speed bumps

and the relationship doesn't end

489

:

because the account's not closed.

490

:

And, and, and I think it's similar

in fitness and, and business

491

:

and romantic relationships.

492

:

Great friendships.

493

:

You know, I, I just love that analogy

that you talked about, the account.

494

:

We all have accounts with everybody.

495

:

We.

496

:

Interact with

497

:

Kathryn: when I was a kid

and I would go camping.

498

:

My mom had a rule when we would

camp, and it was to always leave the

499

:

campsite better than he found it.

500

:

So we always had to clean up

everything and make it look good.

501

:

Well, since I was a child, I just, I've

embodied that concept with everything.

502

:

Like, I leave every person, every space.

503

:

I'm not perfect, but I really do try to

be present and consider what I'm saying

504

:

and how I'm treating people and try and

leave spaces better than I found them.

505

:

And I think if everybody could kind

of take that concept and like be more

506

:

accountable in our space, like a lot

of stuff in our world would be better.

507

:

Yeah.

508

:

Tyler: Yeah.

509

:

There's a quote that has like, traveled

with me since middle school and it's be

510

:

the change you wanna see in the world.

511

:

Kathryn: Yes.

512

:

Tyler: So it goes back

to the same thing too.

513

:

So like if you see something

that there's a piece of trash

514

:

on the ground, you're like, oh,

why'd they throw that down there?

515

:

Well pick it up and throw it away,

or whatever that case may be.

516

:

Don't perpetuate the negative energy,

517

:

Mike: be part of the positive.

518

:

We're, we're so easily irritated as

a society by stupid things, right?

519

:

Mm-hmm.

520

:

I mean, mean even, even driving you

know, I remember someone was with

521

:

me and, and, and someone had cut

really close in front of, of my car.

522

:

And I didn't move, like I

just broke and that was it.

523

:

And they're right.

524

:

How are you not honking the horn?

525

:

How are you not upset?

526

:

I was like, they just cut you off.

527

:

And I, I said, no, they didn't.

528

:

They said they just cut you off.

529

:

I said, no, they cut a car off.

530

:

They don't know who I am.

531

:

Kathryn: Mm-hmm.

532

:

Mike: You know, we personalize these

things so rapidly with such rapid offense

533

:

that we are unable to see the path towards

our own goals because we're letting

534

:

strangers literally withdraw from our

own personal bank account with ourselves.

535

:

Right.

536

:

That's a withdraw I took personal offense.

537

:

If, if you take personal offense

and stuff like that, you're

538

:

withdrawing from your own account.

539

:

Right.

540

:

That's the other

self-esteem relationships.

541

:

Have a bank balance your self.

542

:

You have a self-esteem balance

and that is withdrawing from your

543

:

self-esteem, that you're taking

offense that they cut me off.

544

:

They don't even know who you are.

545

:

Yeah.

546

:

And, and it's, it's

just, it's amazing how.

547

:

I went through life like

that for a long time.

548

:

Right.

549

:

But hopefully, you know, podcasts like

this and podcasts I've listened to, and

550

:

the Ed Millets and the Brendan Bouchard's

and the Mel Robbins of the world.

551

:

If you, if you consume that instead

of doom scrolling, you know, you

552

:

kind of start to turn to the point

where you really can live joyfully

553

:

daily, even while everybody else

says the world is crashing around us.

554

:

It's not.

555

:

This is not atypical.

556

:

You know, I love when people

say this is unprecedented.

557

:

You know, we were burning down

churches during desegregation, right?

558

:

Mm-hmm.

559

:

We, we, we had hostages in

Iran in the late seventies.

560

:

Like nothing is unprecedented,

and I think the speed of

561

:

communication is unprecedented.

562

:

But yeah.

563

:

But I, and I, that's not to diminish

that we have real challenges.

564

:

But people take such personal offense

to things that don't really impact

565

:

them on a daily basis where they could

really be a light for the world if they

566

:

stop letting everybody else dim them.

567

:

Kathryn: Well, Mike, that speaks to how

much like you and I have both changed

568

:

significantly in the last two years, but

how calm your nervous system is and that

569

:

things like that, maybe not specifically

with vehicles, but other things would've

570

:

maybe caused reaction out of you.

571

:

Now that don't, and I think a lot

of it is just through like moving

572

:

slower and being more intentional

and so much of that external

573

:

expression that all of us are giving.

574

:

It's because we're not taking

accountability for how uncomfortable

575

:

we are inside of ourselves.

576

:

We're projecting that onto somebody else

and we want them to take responsibility

577

:

rather than realizing when that car

cuts you off and you have that big

578

:

reaction, why, what's happening inside

of you that's making that happen?

579

:

Don't point at that person.

580

:

That person, like you said, has no

idea who you are, what in your life.

581

:

It's making you so uncomfortable

inside yourself that you need everybody

582

:

around you to take accountability

rather than looking in the mirror.

583

:

Mike: I love the, the one of the best

questions, and I do this in leadership

584

:

with our teams when there's conflict,

but I've also carried it on to me what's

585

:

the story you're telling yourself?

586

:

Mm, mm-hmm.

587

:

And it's, it's usually not real, right?

588

:

Oh, yeah.

589

:

For so many people, it's not a real story.

590

:

And, and it's such a, a

fascinating like place to get to.

591

:

Catherine and I have been friends

for years and we've had fortunately,

592

:

hundreds of hours of, of conversations.

593

:

So our interaction is supernatural

and I love it, but she's helped me

594

:

to grow so much as a man and vice

versa in understanding masculinity and

595

:

femininity and, and the interaction

between those two dynamics, not just

596

:

in a, in a healthy friendship, but then

in a healthy, romantic relationship.

597

:

And I think

598

:

Kathryn: with Stephanie, not me.

599

:

That's right.

600

:

Yeah.

601

:

Mike: That's why I said

healthy friendship.

602

:

But, but we, we just, it's, people

don't talk about this stuff.

603

:

And, you know, that's what's wonderful

about y'all's podcast and who you bring

604

:

on and, you know, if there's just a few

people that listen and it helps to change

605

:

a little bit, to bring a little more joy

it, it really is such a meaningful thing

606

:

that, that you guys facilitate here.

607

:

Tyler: So you bring up some, and then

talking about like, the emotional part

608

:

that I had, what I showed that before too.

609

:

And then kind of what you

said with the podcast love.

610

:

So over the last few weeks, there's been

a lot going on in the world that has

611

:

brought out a lot of emotions from people.

612

:

Kathryn: Yeah.

613

:

Tyler: And I probably had at least

a half dozen people because of the

614

:

podcast that have been on the podcast.

615

:

They're like, Tylee, what

are you gonna do about this?

616

:

So there's two things that

come to my mind with that.

617

:

Like, I take a lot of responsibility

that people look to me as a leader.

618

:

Or as a thought, thought leader or as a

someone who's strong on their faith or

619

:

leadership, whatever the case may be, to

be like, okay, like there's something I

620

:

need to find here to go beyond myself.

621

:

And then on the other side of

that, it's also kind of sad that

622

:

there's other people that they look

for someone else to take charge.

623

:

It's like, do you have something

that's like dwelling inside you

624

:

that's that strong and you're

reaching out to someone to do that?

625

:

There's just as much

power inside of everyone.

626

:

Kathryn: Yeah.

627

:

Tyler: To do that.

628

:

There's something that you can do in your

corner to help make that positive impact.

629

:

And so like, I'm glad people see me to

make a large impact, either with a podcast

630

:

or through like some wisdom I can impart

or to lead 'em to someone else like

631

:

yourselves, because I know you guys are

more than happy to talk to anyone anytime

632

:

about anything they're struggling with.

633

:

But just knowing that everyone out there

who's listening to this, you can strongly,

634

:

positively impact your own corner as well.

635

:

Kathryn: Well, we're all leaders

exactly the way that you said that, but

636

:

I feel like the difference in a true

leader and what we're seeing a lot of.

637

:

Negativity in our world through leadership

that is looking of, how can you serve me?

638

:

What can you do for me?

639

:

Why aren't you doing this for me?

640

:

Versus the way you just express

yourself of how can I serve others?

641

:

That's true leadership,

true leaders create leaders.

642

:

You pull people up versus standing up on

the throne and telling people what to do.

643

:

I mean, that's the whole reason

we created America anyway.

644

:

Right.

645

:

Well,

646

:

Mike: and I think, I think far too

often, everybody expects everybody

647

:

to have an opinion on everything.

648

:

It's perfectly okay, and I say it all the

time, I, I don't have an, I, I don't know

649

:

enough about that to have an opinion.

650

:

Kathryn: Mm-hmm.

651

:

Mike: Well, what do you mean?

652

:

Well, don't know enough about that.

653

:

I have an opinion and, and I have

someone that's close to me, but

654

:

said, how do you feel about this?

655

:

I said I love that

you're convicted by that.

656

:

I'm not.

657

:

Mm-hmm.

658

:

Right?

659

:

And, and you don't have to

be convicted by everything.

660

:

You don't have to have

an opinion on everything.

661

:

I actually think that, that actually,

it's a sign of intelligence to be

662

:

able to look at someone and say,

I really have an opinion on that.

663

:

I get asked a lot on, you

know, politically speaking.

664

:

What's going on in a lot of facets.

665

:

I, I don't really have an opinion.

666

:

Do you wanna talk about how I

can help people become homeless?

667

:

How, how I can help people change

their life through generational home

668

:

ownership, which changes the lives of

children, all of those sorts of things.

669

:

Let's talk for hours, but if you want

to talk to me about geopolitics or

670

:

all of that sort of stuff, it's okay

not to have an opinion on everything.

671

:

I actually think it's a sign

of intelligence, not a lack of

672

:

intelligence to be able to say that.

673

:

Tyler: I'm gonna use this just to

pick on it for like a half a second.

674

:

Not saying that's not important.

675

:

Mike: Please

676

:

Tyler: don't, don't at me.

677

:

But like what's going on with

Israel and Gaza, there's so many

678

:

people that have just like a clip

of something that they saw and

679

:

they want to have an opinion on it.

680

:

That is such a complex,

centuries long situation.

681

:

I can guarantee you 99.9%

682

:

of you that have an opinion on it.

683

:

Don't even know the

first thing was going on.

684

:

Like it's okay not to

have an opinion about it.

685

:

You can look at something and say,

oh my gosh, that's really sad.

686

:

I wish that didn't happen.

687

:

That's fine.

688

:

But to have like a conviction, like you

said on something about you, something

689

:

you don't know about, I think it's

okay to be like, Hey, that's sad.

690

:

I don't know enough about it.

691

:

Like you said, and on, if

you're getting it through reels.

692

:

Right, exactly.

693

:

You,

694

:

Mike: you probably shouldn't form an

opinion based on the reels that you see.

695

:

Well,

696

:

Kathryn: some of the most profound

leaders in history like Gandhi or even

697

:

the Bitcoin duck picture that you and

I both have in our homes, I mean, it's

698

:

pure silence that they were able to

create some of the greatest change.

699

:

And if, going back to, circling back

to what we were talking about before,

700

:

if those people that are overly

reacting to all of these things took

701

:

half of that amount of energy and just

applied it to their own community and

702

:

actually created positive change and

things that they could actually touch.

703

:

If everybody did that, our

world would be so different.

704

:

And I'm just gonna keep harping

on that because nobody's willing

705

:

to take accountability for what's

happening in inside themselves

706

:

or inside their own home.

707

:

And that's where the true change starts.

708

:

Chris: I mean, you need to start locally.

709

:

Like part of the reason I'm assuming

why you ran for city council,

710

:

right, was to affect change locally.

711

:

Oh, I we're always seeing broadcast

news shows you stuff that's happening

712

:

across the country or internationally,

but it very rarely shows you

713

:

what's happening where you are.

714

:

And that's really what's

going to affect you.

715

:

Like looking at the news is great.

716

:

Are you watching multiple sources?

717

:

Are you watching the same source

to get all your information?

718

:

Are you talking to the guy next

to you and asking him like,

719

:

oh, so like you live in Leland.

720

:

How is it going out there?

721

:

Like what does the

things look like for you?

722

:

I live here in Wilmington.

723

:

This is how it's going

and asking those things.

724

:

What's your opinion on, you

know, all the people moving

725

:

here from New York or Philly?

726

:

Do you care?

727

:

Do you not care?

728

:

How is it affecting you?

729

:

But instead we're just, oh,

look at that TikTok reel.

730

:

Let's look at this.

731

:

And I think general, we just need

to work better in our local area.

732

:

Start in your neighborhood.

733

:

Make sure the kids can go

outside and play a little bit.

734

:

They should be able to do the old

school way of like, oh, the lights

735

:

came on, let's go back to the house.

736

:

Like, we should all be, we should get

to a point where you're living life.

737

:

Your kids can come home, eat dinner, go

outside and play, and not be as worried.

738

:

Kathryn: I think it's

even smaller than that.

739

:

Like I feel like when I ran

for office like that was, I

740

:

needed to come home to me first.

741

:

And while, yes, I was delusional

and thought that I could really help

742

:

our community, once you actually

got get in that seat, there's

743

:

really not a whole lot you can do.

744

:

Mm-hmm.

745

:

That's the same reason

I joined the military.

746

:

Like, I thought I could like help and

protect our country and do all these great

747

:

things, but like one person really can't

do much to like the entire like country.

748

:

Mm-hmm.

749

:

But when you start taking accountability

and self-awareness, like, the pyramids,

750

:

the quote on the outside is know thy self.

751

:

Mm-hmm.

752

:

Like, I feel like it's almost an anomaly

that they intentionally left all of

753

:

their like material while being, like

everything was in there of all of their

754

:

diamonds and all of their stuff and these

things, they couldn't take that with them.

755

:

Mm-hmm.

756

:

But they chose to put on the outside

of the pyramids of no thyself.

757

:

So I think the change

literally just starts with you.

758

:

How are you speaking to yourself?

759

:

How are you speaking to

your significant other?

760

:

How are you speaking to your children?

761

:

Like, are your thoughts in aligned

with your words and are your

762

:

words in aligned with your action?

763

:

And if you're not in that

alignment, then why are you

764

:

judging others for not being there?

765

:

Start with you.

766

:

Mike: I was in DC maybe a month

or so ago, visiting my sister.

767

:

Mm-hmm.

768

:

And my sister is an art history

major, wonderful human works

769

:

at the National Gallery.

770

:

We're very different.

771

:

I'm not artistic in any way, shape

or form, but I love going to things

772

:

and have such an appreciation for it.

773

:

And she took us to a park one

of the national parks in DC and

774

:

took us to a bonsai exhibit.

775

:

Mm-hmm.

776

:

This was fascinating.

777

:

There's hundreds of bonsai trees in there.

778

:

And there's actually one that

survived the nuclear bomb in

779

:

Japan that's in the, in DC.

780

:

Mm-hmm.

781

:

That was, I think it was two miles from

the epicenter of Hiroshima or Nagasaki.

782

:

And I, I naively asked my sister,

what, what kind of tree is a bonsai?

783

:

And she said, any tree can be a bonsai.

784

:

It's how you prune it.

785

:

The pot it's in and, and keeping that.

786

:

And then, and then we kept going

and she said, as a matter of

787

:

fact, here's a redwood Bonsai.

788

:

I haven't been able to

stop thinking about that.

789

:

So here, here's this seed mm-hmm.

790

:

That is in this pot that for,

and in this case, I think this

791

:

redwood was like 80 years old,

you should see some of the dates.

792

:

There's a hundred plus year old bonsais.

793

:

There's 152 in this display.

794

:

Mm-hmm.

795

:

And then you, you think about the redwood

in Northern California and this, you can

796

:

drive through the center of some of them.

797

:

Mm-hmm.

798

:

And what really led me to think

about it was who's pruning you?

799

:

Kathryn: Mm-hmm.

800

:

Mike: Who are you allowing to prune you?

801

:

Because the seed that God put in you,

you're, you can be a giant redwood.

802

:

Mm-hmm.

803

:

Everyone but, but it is social media.

804

:

It's the news can prune you.

805

:

It's doom scrolling can prune you.

806

:

It's all of these offenses can prune you.

807

:

And I, I think at, at the end of

the day that really, you know, I

808

:

got really quiet the rest of the

day to the tune of my family and,

809

:

and Stephanie, is everything okay?

810

:

I was like, no, I'm, I'm just

deeply in thought because I think

811

:

for a long time, you know, I

certainly was pruned by others.

812

:

And I, I think I'm at a point now where,

you know, I'm perfectly fine being candid.

813

:

'cause I think candor is love.

814

:

I mean, I think it was first

John when Jesus came, said

815

:

he, I come in grace and truth.

816

:

Mm-hmm.

817

:

We lie to people every day,

like, like about anything.

818

:

'cause we think we might offend them.

819

:

But I think when you're authentic

in your response, not mean, but

820

:

authentic authenticity and belief

actually vibrate above love.

821

:

And when you deeply think about

it, right, when you were a kid,

822

:

you probably had a teacher.

823

:

That would tell you.

824

:

Like, it was, I remember mine, I think

it was fifth or sixth grade, it was Mr.

825

:

Serfas.

826

:

He would get on me so hard,

like, Kosky, what the heck?

827

:

You're so disorganized.

828

:

Your papers crumbled.

829

:

Your backpack's a mess.

830

:

Go sit in the hall and

get your stuff together.

831

:

Right.

832

:

And I'd be like, just jackass.

833

:

But, but I, I knew my mom absolutely loved

me, but, but at the same time, it was

834

:

like, okay, I need, I need this challenge.

835

:

I need this authenticity.

836

:

And I, I, I think Catherine, may I

say things and, and Stephanie, the

837

:

girl I'm dating it, like, say stuff

and she's like, I don't understand

838

:

how you don't get punched in the face.

839

:

But I think, I think we all

have some people in our life

840

:

where you feel an authenticity.

841

:

Mm-hmm.

842

:

You feel a grace and truth.

843

:

And I, I think we'd, we'd really be a

better society starting on your block to.

844

:

In your home, in your home, on your

block, in your town, that, that we

845

:

stop trying to be so mealy mouthed.

846

:

And if you're asked your opinion,

just confidently give it.

847

:

Or if you don't have one, don't.

848

:

But, but I think at the end of the day,

who's pruning you in into that bonsai tree

849

:

when you really could be a giant redwood.

850

:

Tyler: I like that.

851

:

That's actually a quote part of a quote

that I saw too with truth and grace.

852

:

So truth without grace is brutality

and grace without truth is inauthentic.

853

:

Kathryn: I need to remember that?

854

:

Oh, that's so good.

855

:

That's beautiful.

856

:

Tyler: So I heard that and

I was like, oh my gosh.

857

:

Like, that hits perfectly.

858

:

And back to the pruning, that's,

that's biblical as well too.

859

:

So even God calls himself

the actual vine dresser.

860

:

So back to who was actually pruning you.

861

:

Is make a big difference,

like you said on how

862

:

Kathryn: Mike and I probably say some

of the most offensive stuff to each

863

:

other in the most loving way though.

864

:

And there's been so many moments in

our friendship where one of us had

865

:

said something where if it was anybody

else, it would not have been received

866

:

well, but because it came from us.

867

:

That's so true.

868

:

It's acceptable.

869

:

Mm-hmm.

870

:

And I have some profound ones that

you have given me, but one that really

871

:

stood out to me, I wasn't in the space

to hear it at the time you said it to

872

:

me, because I didn't have the mental,

emotional, spiritual connection to

873

:

myself to fully feel what you said.

874

:

But it was right when the first time I

told him that I was gonna run for office

875

:

and I was really excited about it.

876

:

My business was doing the best

it had ever done, and I just was

877

:

gonna add even more to my plate.

878

:

And he goes, no matter what you decide

I'm gonna support you, but I have to ask.

879

:

What are you running from?

880

:

And I was like, what do you mean?

881

:

He was like, why do you feel the need

to put so much stuff on your plate?

882

:

What are you running from?

883

:

And immediately at the time

I was like, psh, I'm fine.

884

:

I don't need that.

885

:

But after everything slowed down

and my life calmed down, I realized

886

:

that I was in survival mode.

887

:

Not because of the campaign, but

just my whole life from being in the

888

:

military, from having to win a lot

of awards, from having to be the best

889

:

of whatever it was that I got into.

890

:

I was running from life rather than

sitting with life and experiencing life.

891

:

And I truly think a lot of my

growth is what's attracted the

892

:

beautiful relationship I have now.

893

:

Because I now have a partner, Alan, who.

894

:

Calls me out even more than

you do, and he creates space

895

:

for me to be my highest self.

896

:

And before him, I

would've thought that Ms.

897

:

Hyper Independent, that I didn't need

anybody and that I could, you know,

898

:

be my highest self all by myself.

899

:

But you and I talk about the masculine

and feminine energy a lot, and through

900

:

his very like safe, masculine container,

I am the highest version of myself.

901

:

And through your friendship of calling

me out and keeping me accountable

902

:

to myself, like that's where I

feel like my growth has come from.

903

:

Mike: Oh yeah.

904

:

It, it, and I'll, I'll, I'll echo the fact

that I've been the best relationship I've

905

:

ever been in with the most amazing woman.

906

:

And a lot of that has to be that

I've now have a safe masculinity.

907

:

And, and I think that, you know,

men frequently confuse masculinity

908

:

with dominance, which it's not.

909

:

And I think we've talked about that as

the difference between recreation and

910

:

entertainment and, and there's this.

911

:

Manly entertainment of all day

football and screaming at a TV and

912

:

wearing jerseys with another man's

name on your back and my team.

913

:

And, and that's fine.

914

:

I mean, if you do that and you're

occasionally and you, you root for a team.

915

:

But, but I think it's gotten excessive

where like, you are supposed to be

916

:

considered more of a man when you have,

you know, more about your fantasy league

917

:

than your kids' grades and their school.

918

:

Yeah.

919

:

Mm-hmm.

920

:

And you're screaming at a tv.

921

:

And I know some friends of mine

are acquaintances, at least, like,

922

:

they're so unemotionally regulated.

923

:

They, they have to be alone

for the big game because they,

924

:

they can't handle themselves.

925

:

And I think, you know, that goes

back to the masculinity, femininity,

926

:

and the confusion of, of how do I

draw the feminine out of my partner?

927

:

Well, it's by being

masculine but not dominant.

928

:

In, in that aspect.

929

:

And it's just really a, it, it's

been a fascinating journey in

930

:

Catherine and i's friendship.

931

:

'cause I, I'm, I'm a better man because

of our friendship and I finally attracted

932

:

such an amazing woman because of these

types of conversations we're having here.

933

:

We have for hours,

934

:

Kathryn: well, two things.

935

:

One his girlfriend Stephanie was,

her and I were friends before and

936

:

she was on the same track as me.

937

:

We're both in real estate.

938

:

Mm-hmm.

939

:

And she gave me permission to rest.

940

:

She tapped into her feminine

energy way before I did, and

941

:

she inspires me constantly.

942

:

But going back to what he was saying

specifically about the football

943

:

aggression, we actually talked about

this at breakfast this morning, and one

944

:

of the things in our society is that

the only socially acceptable emotion

945

:

for Amanda to display is aggression.

946

:

And aggression is

actually, actually wounded.

947

:

Masculine energy.

948

:

Okay?

949

:

Like that safety container

that we keep talking about that

950

:

is divine masculine energy.

951

:

And when men are in that wounded,

aggressive, masculine energy, it puts a

952

:

woman into their wounded feminine energy,

which is that desperate, that needy,

953

:

and then they start taking control.

954

:

And there's a whole thing we can

get into, but it's what our society

955

:

has gotten into because we have went

so far on the pendulum of trying to

956

:

suppress the male energy and then put

the female energy up on a pedestal.

957

:

But we mutually need each other.

958

:

And both energies are incredibly

powerful, but women have to learn how

959

:

to surrender and soften, which that

does not mean giving up your power.

960

:

If anything, that means finding the depth

of your power and then have to be able to.

961

:

Willing to share more

emotions than just anger.

962

:

Like just now when you were talking

about that part of the Bible and like

963

:

your relationship to that story, like

you can tell how regulated your nervous

964

:

system is and how safe you are in your

body because you can express that.

965

:

And Mike does the same thing.

966

:

And Chris, honestly, you have some of

the most loving, warm energy of like it

967

:

man, that I've ever remember when I first

met you, you like hugged me and I was

968

:

like, I was like, where, where we going?

969

:

Where we going?

970

:

But you, you do, you have

very inviting and warm energy.

971

:

And I think a lot of men think that if I

can just be cold and serious and distant,

972

:

that I'm s stok and I'm masculine.

973

:

But even stoic energy

doesn't mean that disconnect.

974

:

If you can't feel others, you can't

feel yourself and you're not truly you.

975

:

Mike: Mm-hmm.

976

:

Well, and and, and we've talked about

this, I think when it says the man

977

:

is the head of the household in the

Bible, I think, I think that means

978

:

the head, meaning where your brain

is and then the woman is the heart.

979

:

So it's the head and the heart which have

to go together and equal but different.

980

:

And, and I think that, that the, the

desire of, of, of our gender as men is

981

:

to utilize that passage as a weapon.

982

:

I'm the head of the household.

983

:

Well, you know, are you, are you,

are you taking care of the things

984

:

the head is supposed to take care of?

985

:

Or are you watching football day

Saturday and Sunday while the

986

:

heart is worried about whether

the bills are gonna get paid?

987

:

And when's the last time that we've

been on a date and are you gonna

988

:

be able to take the kids to school?

989

:

Are you gonna be able

to help me with this?

990

:

And so I, I think it's, it's such a

fascinating conversation that I wish,

991

:

I wish more people would have grace and

truth together with each other, with

992

:

auth, authenticity, and not utilize.

993

:

Some of the things that we talk

about as a weapon against each other.

994

:

It's a go

995

:

Tyler: ahead, sorry.

996

:

What you said too about like the man

being the head of the household, when

997

:

you actually translate it back in

the Hebrew, so it says the man is the

998

:

leader and the woman is the helper.

999

:

The only other time they use that word

helper is when it has man leaning on God.

:

00:42:14,281 --> 00:42:14,401

Yeah.

:

00:42:14,461 --> 00:42:18,811

So it actually is going way beyond

of being submissive to the husband,

:

00:42:18,811 --> 00:42:21,811

but saying that the man needs to

lean on his wife as he would lean

:

00:42:21,811 --> 00:42:24,991

on God for the help to actually

move forward and to move through

:

00:42:24,991 --> 00:42:26,851

this life together is very powerful.

:

00:42:26,851 --> 00:42:27,061

I heard that.

:

00:42:27,066 --> 00:42:27,436

That's so good.

:

00:42:27,506 --> 00:42:27,796

Well,

:

00:42:27,796 --> 00:42:32,041

Kathryn: and so many women,

myself included, I have always

:

00:42:32,041 --> 00:42:33,421

been in my masculine energy.

:

00:42:33,421 --> 00:42:37,531

I didn't realize that, but I was a female

that could run with the best of them.

:

00:42:37,531 --> 00:42:39,391

That's just what I've

always done my whole life.

:

00:42:39,391 --> 00:42:42,571

My mother was the same

way and I always saw like.

:

00:42:43,206 --> 00:42:47,556

Stay at home moms and things like that is

less than, but like now in my life where

:

00:42:47,676 --> 00:42:54,516

I've shifted to like the divine masculine

energy holds space for a woman to be able

:

00:42:54,516 --> 00:43:00,036

to be so in touch with their emotions and

their intuition, that they can be that

:

00:43:00,036 --> 00:43:05,136

intuitive connection to God's source,

whatever you call it, to help the man be

:

00:43:05,136 --> 00:43:09,066

in the material world and do what needs

to be done to come home to that space

:

00:43:09,096 --> 00:43:10,986

of the safety container that he creates.

:

00:43:11,076 --> 00:43:12,786

And I think we've just lost sight of that.

:

00:43:14,346 --> 00:43:15,156

Mike: Yeah.

:

00:43:15,156 --> 00:43:20,166

And, and, and I, I go back to the,

to the analogy on the pruning, right?

:

00:43:21,306 --> 00:43:28,866

Every social media post and what, what

I think people don't realize and is

:

00:43:28,866 --> 00:43:31,926

that every time you look at a social

media post, you're doing two things,

:

00:43:31,926 --> 00:43:33,906

and this comes from somebody else.

:

00:43:33,906 --> 00:43:37,086

So I, I take no credit for

this, but you're, you're

:

00:43:37,086 --> 00:43:38,616

judging and you're comparing.

:

00:43:38,916 --> 00:43:39,156

Yeah.

:

00:43:39,606 --> 00:43:39,816

Right.

:

00:43:39,816 --> 00:43:41,946

You're judging, am I gonna like this?

:

00:43:42,561 --> 00:43:43,941

Am I gonna forward this?

:

00:43:44,061 --> 00:43:45,441

Am I gonna repost this?

:

00:43:45,921 --> 00:43:48,891

And then you're comparing

your life to that post.

:

00:43:49,611 --> 00:43:54,111

And I think we've, we are,

we're a lot of a generation

:

00:43:54,651 --> 00:43:58,371

that does less and is exhausted

:

00:44:00,381 --> 00:44:01,491

so fast.

:

00:44:02,031 --> 00:44:05,091

And I don't think you

understand the mental energy

:

00:44:05,091 --> 00:44:06,981

drain every time you do that.

:

00:44:07,701 --> 00:44:10,941

Like, judge compare, judge

compare, judge compare.

:

00:44:11,241 --> 00:44:13,671

And that's the pruning process, right?

:

00:44:13,671 --> 00:44:18,111

At literally every time you're, you're

sitting there and you're being, you're

:

00:44:18,171 --> 00:44:21,261

judging and comparing, you know, and

if you look at the average amount of

:

00:44:21,261 --> 00:44:25,581

time that we're on social media for the

average American, the amount of time

:

00:44:25,611 --> 00:44:30,111

for especially children and TikTok and

all this other stuff, they're exhausted.

:

00:44:30,381 --> 00:44:32,601

They're stressed out by everything.

:

00:44:32,811 --> 00:44:35,001

But that's not just kids, it's adults too.

:

00:44:35,181 --> 00:44:38,241

I mean, I, I was sadly

looking at a table I was.

:

00:44:39,066 --> 00:44:41,376

Traveling in a hotel, and I

looked over and there's a dad

:

00:44:41,376 --> 00:44:42,486

with three kids sitting there.

:

00:44:42,876 --> 00:44:48,036

The three kids had their babysitter, IEA

screen, and the dad was on his phone.

:

00:44:48,096 --> 00:44:51,456

They ate breakfast at the

buffet and this nice hotel.

:

00:44:52,206 --> 00:44:56,676

They did not say one word to

each other the entire time at

:

00:44:56,676 --> 00:44:58,026

this family was sitting there.

:

00:44:58,056 --> 00:45:02,196

And that's pruning, pruning the

seed that's within each of 'em.

:

00:45:02,256 --> 00:45:07,236

That, that, that father has a seed

in him to be a, a wonderful father.

:

00:45:07,656 --> 00:45:11,016

And, and, and that's not to say

there's not so many circumstances

:

00:45:11,016 --> 00:45:12,936

that, that are easily justified.

:

00:45:12,936 --> 00:45:15,156

I mean, lost the job, got beat

up, went through bankruptcy.

:

00:45:15,186 --> 00:45:18,306

Everybody, you know, you,

you have those stories.

:

00:45:18,816 --> 00:45:23,796

But I think the big thing is at some

point in life, if you're sitting

:

00:45:23,796 --> 00:45:29,226

here listening to this, you know, you

just have to take extreme ownership

:

00:45:29,226 --> 00:45:32,976

and say, you know what I'm taking, I

don't have social media on my phone.

:

00:45:33,771 --> 00:45:38,751

I have social media, but it's on my

laptop and I intentionally am, you

:

00:45:38,751 --> 00:45:43,671

know, I I, I mean, I, I always joke, I

was like, I think 85% of all posts on

:

00:45:43,671 --> 00:45:45,171

social media are done in a bathroom.

:

00:45:45,681 --> 00:45:47,241

Like the, the number.

:

00:45:47,241 --> 00:45:51,051

How many people have you seen

literally that came back to the table?

:

00:45:51,411 --> 00:45:53,841

'cause they were going to the

bathroom and forgot their phone.

:

00:45:54,381 --> 00:45:54,531

Chris: Oh yeah.

:

00:45:54,891 --> 00:45:55,371

Mike: Right.

:

00:45:55,371 --> 00:45:56,841

I mean, it's crazy.

:

00:45:56,841 --> 00:45:58,506

So much interaction is on the toilet.

:

00:45:58,506 --> 00:46:04,521

And if, if we change that mindset to say,

I'm being pruned, I'm being pruned by

:

00:46:04,521 --> 00:46:07,551

the algorithms, I'm being pruned by tv.

:

00:46:07,551 --> 00:46:12,081

They call it programming and

TV programs for a reason.

:

00:46:12,741 --> 00:46:13,131

You know?

:

00:46:13,131 --> 00:46:18,271

And so, so I think that's the challenge

is and, and hopefully that's why you

:

00:46:18,271 --> 00:46:22,891

do this show, is if, if just a handful

of people go, you know what, I'm

:

00:46:22,891 --> 00:46:24,481

deleting social media from my phone.

:

00:46:24,481 --> 00:46:29,911

I'm only going to time a

block it on my computer.

:

00:46:29,911 --> 00:46:32,341

I'm going to not have

my phone constantly at.

:

00:46:32,926 --> 00:46:37,156

On the table or with me, you know,

I love Simon Sinek is fantastic.

:

00:46:37,156 --> 00:46:40,336

He's, he was given a speech and he

started a speech with his phone in his

:

00:46:40,336 --> 00:46:43,546

hand, and he wasn't looking at it at all.

:

00:46:43,756 --> 00:46:44,236

Kathryn: Heard the story.

:

00:46:44,236 --> 00:46:44,386

Yeah.

:

00:46:44,476 --> 00:46:47,146

Mike: And then, and then he put it in

his pocket and he continued to speech.

:

00:46:47,146 --> 00:46:48,886

He said, hold on a

minute, I have a question.

:

00:46:49,066 --> 00:46:52,786

How many of you were listening to what

I said when I had my phone in my hand?

:

00:46:53,026 --> 00:46:56,236

Or you felt like I wasn't fully

present with you, but as soon as

:

00:46:56,236 --> 00:46:59,236

you couldn't see my phone, you

knew I was fully present with you?

:

00:46:59,236 --> 00:47:01,546

A hundred percent of the

hands went up yet how?

:

00:47:01,546 --> 00:47:02,956

Somehow, right.

:

00:47:02,956 --> 00:47:05,806

I, I'm, I'm looking here and like,

nobody's got their phone here while we're

:

00:47:05,806 --> 00:47:11,866

having this conversation and, and, and

there's a presence that to, to that.

:

00:47:11,866 --> 00:47:15,226

And you know, I heard a podcast

the other day, which was wonderful.

:

00:47:15,466 --> 00:47:21,466

It said most people spend their

entire life either regretting or

:

00:47:21,466 --> 00:47:27,376

reminiscing about the past or planning

and worrying about the future.

:

00:47:28,426 --> 00:47:30,466

And they don't spend any.

:

00:47:31,156 --> 00:47:34,126

Time in the moment that is the present.

:

00:47:34,486 --> 00:47:37,306

That literally is the

only time we ever live.

:

00:47:37,726 --> 00:47:39,436

It's today, right now, this moment.

:

00:47:39,706 --> 00:47:42,556

We cannot live in the future

and we cannot live in the past.

:

00:47:42,736 --> 00:47:44,596

That's not to say that

we shouldn't set goals.

:

00:47:44,896 --> 00:47:48,526

That's not to say that it's not okay

to have great objectives for the

:

00:47:48,526 --> 00:47:53,776

future, but when it paralyzes you to

the point, it's pruning you because

:

00:47:53,776 --> 00:47:55,816

you have nothing in the present.

:

00:47:56,326 --> 00:48:00,676

You know, we all know the, the, the

high school sports jock that the letter

:

00:48:00,676 --> 00:48:02,266

and still talks about the glory days.

:

00:48:02,266 --> 00:48:02,386

Mm-hmm.

:

00:48:02,626 --> 00:48:05,356

And then we also talk about the person

that I can't believe that person left

:

00:48:05,356 --> 00:48:10,426

me and they can't get over divorce or a

past thing that went wrong in their life.

:

00:48:10,816 --> 00:48:14,926

And then you also know the people that

they never talk about how joyful their

:

00:48:14,926 --> 00:48:19,276

life is, their relationships are, their

children are, their friendships are today.

:

00:48:19,456 --> 00:48:22,186

They're always talking about

what could possibly be in the

:

00:48:22,186 --> 00:48:23,986

future to make them happy.

:

00:48:24,346 --> 00:48:28,156

And, and I think living, you know,

it's, it's so cliche to say, they

:

00:48:28,156 --> 00:48:29,866

call it the present for a reason.

:

00:48:30,286 --> 00:48:34,936

Really the happiest people I know,

the most joyful people I know really

:

00:48:34,936 --> 00:48:39,796

don't talk much about the past, except

like any lessons they've learned

:

00:48:39,796 --> 00:48:41,506

to get 'em to where they are today.

:

00:48:41,836 --> 00:48:46,996

They talk about where

things can be in the future.

:

00:48:47,206 --> 00:48:49,486

They almost don't talk

about people at all.

:

00:48:49,996 --> 00:48:52,876

Kathryn: Well, when I first got

out of the military, I had, my

:

00:48:52,876 --> 00:48:55,996

identity was wrapped around that

and I would always talk about it.

:

00:48:55,996 --> 00:48:59,476

I felt like it was so important and

I realized that a lot of the reasons

:

00:48:59,476 --> 00:49:03,856

that a lot of us live in the past or

constantly are talking about our goals

:

00:49:03,856 --> 00:49:06,646

in the future is because there's some

lack of validation that's happening

:

00:49:06,646 --> 00:49:10,936

in the now that we are seeking some

type of external validation to be able

:

00:49:10,936 --> 00:49:13,336

to make us feel okay in this moment.

:

00:49:13,336 --> 00:49:15,616

And like similarly to what you're

talking about with social media,

:

00:49:16,126 --> 00:49:19,366

supposedly we're the most connected

we've ever been, but yet we're the

:

00:49:19,366 --> 00:49:21,166

most disconnected we've ever been.

:

00:49:21,376 --> 00:49:25,096

And I've been off social media since

April, and I've noticed how many

:

00:49:25,096 --> 00:49:28,036

people on rare occasion now that I

actually have conversations with.

:

00:49:28,411 --> 00:49:31,351

They just assume I know everything

about their life because they've

:

00:49:31,351 --> 00:49:33,721

been posting and they just

think that people look at it.

:

00:49:33,721 --> 00:49:36,481

And even when I was on social

media, I never really scrolled,

:

00:49:36,841 --> 00:49:39,661

but the realization is I don't have

relationships with a lot of people

:

00:49:39,661 --> 00:49:41,311

because they assume I'm following them.

:

00:49:41,881 --> 00:49:43,051

And how disconnected is that?

:

00:49:43,381 --> 00:49:43,531

Yeah,

:

00:49:44,581 --> 00:49:50,821

Chris: and I think, so obviously in the

two thousands when MySpace Facebook, it

:

00:49:50,821 --> 00:49:56,941

took away from that ability for us to

sit and be present so, so many times like

:

00:49:56,941 --> 00:50:01,801

it's, I understand it's great for like the

older people because they're missing out.

:

00:50:01,801 --> 00:50:06,026

Like they don't get to see their grandkids

or like their children all the time.

:

00:50:06,026 --> 00:50:09,211

Definitely because they're so far away

and it's a connection, but I think it

:

00:50:09,211 --> 00:50:13,321

still separates them from being present

when you're in this position to be

:

00:50:13,321 --> 00:50:14,641

like, oh, what have you been doing?

:

00:50:14,911 --> 00:50:15,991

Tell me about your life.

:

00:50:16,021 --> 00:50:19,831

Because like you said, everyone assumes

you already know what's going on.

:

00:50:20,251 --> 00:50:22,051

'cause we have access to it.

:

00:50:22,051 --> 00:50:22,501

Well, it's also

:

00:50:22,501 --> 00:50:23,161

Mike: curated.

:

00:50:23,341 --> 00:50:23,521

Yeah.

:

00:50:23,551 --> 00:50:23,671

Mm-hmm.

:

00:50:23,671 --> 00:50:25,081

That's not really their life.

:

00:50:25,111 --> 00:50:25,681

No.

:

00:50:25,681 --> 00:50:26,071

Right.

:

00:50:26,071 --> 00:50:31,381

I mean, I mean, and, and you can

bleep this out, but I mean it,

:

00:50:31,741 --> 00:50:33,031

how many people have scrolled?

:

00:50:33,031 --> 00:50:35,281

I'm like, how is this

bitch on vacation again?

:

00:50:35,581 --> 00:50:35,671

Mm-hmm.

:

00:50:36,211 --> 00:50:36,511

Shut up.

:

00:50:36,511 --> 00:50:37,076

You're always on vacation.

:

00:50:37,226 --> 00:50:37,676

Ever work.

:

00:50:38,341 --> 00:50:43,636

I was gonna say, and also I'm at, how

is this asshole on vacation again?

:

00:50:43,636 --> 00:50:44,316

They never worked.

:

00:50:44,611 --> 00:50:47,221

And that's the judging

your own life, right?

:

00:50:47,221 --> 00:50:47,231

Mm-hmm.

:

00:50:47,281 --> 00:50:54,781

I mean, it's like you get so frustrated by

a false curation of other people's lives.

:

00:50:54,781 --> 00:50:55,771

Mm-hmm.

:

00:50:55,772 --> 00:50:59,821

And you demean your own when

right in front of you is probably

:

00:50:59,821 --> 00:51:03,991

the most amazing potential

relationship if you fed it Right.

:

00:51:03,991 --> 00:51:04,441

What's that?

:

00:51:04,441 --> 00:51:05,041

Which wolf?

:

00:51:05,251 --> 00:51:08,101

Which wolf dies and which

lives the one you feed.

:

00:51:08,191 --> 00:51:08,281

Yep.

:

00:51:08,581 --> 00:51:09,031

Right.

:

00:51:09,031 --> 00:51:15,091

And, and we're feeding, in many

cases, I am blessed to have a

:

00:51:15,091 --> 00:51:16,531

good group of people around me.

:

00:51:16,531 --> 00:51:18,241

And, and that is the challenge.

:

00:51:18,241 --> 00:51:19,651

Sometimes you have to prune.

:

00:51:20,221 --> 00:51:20,881

Circle.

:

00:51:21,781 --> 00:51:22,261

Right.

:

00:51:22,561 --> 00:51:26,041

To make sure your circle isn't pruning you

:

00:51:26,851 --> 00:51:28,381

Kathryn: well, and we're

missing out on being bored.

:

00:51:29,191 --> 00:51:29,491

Mike: Yeah.

:

00:51:30,031 --> 00:51:32,491

Kathryn: Everything in our

world came from boredom.

:

00:51:32,491 --> 00:51:34,081

You're missing out on your creativity.

:

00:51:34,321 --> 00:51:34,411

Mm-hmm.

:

00:51:34,651 --> 00:51:37,981

Like all, both of the, you can be a leader

and that that seat is inside of you.

:

00:51:38,101 --> 00:51:41,881

If you're not sitting with it, if you're

not cultivating it, what are you doing?

:

00:51:41,971 --> 00:51:42,691

Mike: That's such a great point.

:

00:51:42,691 --> 00:51:44,611

Kathryn: Like you're just,

you're missing out on stuff.

:

00:51:44,611 --> 00:51:47,551

Like you're spending so much time

at, like, we're, we're energy.

:

00:51:47,611 --> 00:51:50,731

Everything we do from the energy you get

outta bed in the morning from the energy

:

00:51:50,731 --> 00:51:52,771

that you put out into a thought, whatever.

:

00:51:53,161 --> 00:51:55,501

And when you're wasting it, like

you're talking about with the bank

:

00:51:55,501 --> 00:51:59,311

account and putting it on social

media or watching somebody else's life

:

00:51:59,311 --> 00:52:02,701

through TV or watching somebody else's

success through sports or whatever it

:

00:52:02,701 --> 00:52:05,041

is, you're missing out on your life.

:

00:52:05,041 --> 00:52:07,276

I mean, the world has

been around for, what, 4.5

:

00:52:07,276 --> 00:52:08,161

billion years?

:

00:52:08,161 --> 00:52:09,631

If you're lucky, you might live 80.

:

00:52:09,931 --> 00:52:11,341

What the hell are you doing with it?

:

00:52:12,271 --> 00:52:12,811

Mike: That's it.

:

00:52:12,811 --> 00:52:18,221

You know, what you just said strikes me

as Einstein was sitting in class board.

:

00:52:19,556 --> 00:52:24,116

And not paying attention

at all to the lecture.

:

00:52:25,136 --> 00:52:30,116

And he just started staring at

a clock and he was watching the

:

00:52:30,116 --> 00:52:34,436

second hand tick and tick and

tick slowly and slowly and slowly.

:

00:52:35,516 --> 00:52:37,766

And he said, Hmm, I wonder

why it's ticking forward.

:

00:52:39,866 --> 00:52:41,996

I wonder if you could make that slow down.

:

00:52:42,956 --> 00:52:46,526

And then he started going, I

wonder if there would be a way

:

00:52:47,246 --> 00:52:49,316

to make that clock tick backward.

:

00:52:50,696 --> 00:52:53,126

It's how he created a

theory of relativity.

:

00:52:53,396 --> 00:52:56,696

It was the questions that occurred sitting

in the middle of a class completely

:

00:52:56,696 --> 00:53:00,571

bored, just thinking somebody had,

so you're so right when you say that

:

00:53:01,091 --> 00:53:02,246

Kathryn: somebody had

to stare at the stars.

:

00:53:02,246 --> 00:53:05,456

Somebody had to sit and stare at a

flower to understand photosynthesis.

:

00:53:05,456 --> 00:53:07,676

Like everything in life

is through boredom.

:

00:53:07,676 --> 00:53:10,436

Like you get to know yourself

and instead we're numbing

:

00:53:10,436 --> 00:53:11,786

ourselves through distraction.

:

00:53:12,686 --> 00:53:16,526

Tyler: The most purity you can see is

now that I have is my children, right?

:

00:53:16,676 --> 00:53:16,766

Yeah.

:

00:53:16,796 --> 00:53:20,426

So like you can watch like the most

pure child grow up and then you

:

00:53:20,426 --> 00:53:24,866

can see too, even as like a parent

where you start screwing up, right?

:

00:53:24,866 --> 00:53:27,266

Because it starts happening

quicker, like through them.

:

00:53:27,266 --> 00:53:30,776

So like I realized that my

son was watching like too much

:

00:53:30,776 --> 00:53:32,516

like screens and TV and stuff.

:

00:53:33,386 --> 00:53:35,126

I was like, okay, this, this is not right.

:

00:53:35,126 --> 00:53:36,386

I need to like mess this up.

:

00:53:36,386 --> 00:53:39,686

Because he was like dying for,

you could tell he was addicted.

:

00:53:39,686 --> 00:53:39,746

Yeah.

:

00:53:39,751 --> 00:53:40,151

Dopamine, yeah.

:

00:53:40,196 --> 00:53:41,606

To all of that going on.

:

00:53:41,606 --> 00:53:45,146

So it was like, okay, this is

just at an end and very rarely

:

00:53:45,146 --> 00:53:46,586

when you do it's gonna be low.

:

00:53:46,636 --> 00:53:47,566

What's what I'm looking for?

:

00:53:48,136 --> 00:53:49,246

It's always trying to

catch your attention.

:

00:53:49,246 --> 00:53:53,116

But basically like slower shows

that's not gonna be like hitting

:

00:53:53,116 --> 00:53:56,026

that dopamine receptor right in three

seconds is what they actually found.

:

00:53:56,536 --> 00:54:01,336

And at first it went back to he

kept saying, dad, but I'm bored.

:

00:54:01,666 --> 00:54:02,506

I'm bored.

:

00:54:02,626 --> 00:54:05,536

I said, dude, it's good

to be bored sometimes.

:

00:54:05,566 --> 00:54:06,886

Sometimes you need to be bored.

:

00:54:07,246 --> 00:54:07,616

And he goes.

:

00:54:08,596 --> 00:54:09,616

I don't think so.

:

00:54:09,976 --> 00:54:13,156

And so I was like, well give

it a shot, see what happens.

:

00:54:13,636 --> 00:54:16,126

And then he started like playing

and he came up with this like whole

:

00:54:16,126 --> 00:54:17,986

game and imagination and everything.

:

00:54:17,986 --> 00:54:18,046

Yeah.

:

00:54:18,046 --> 00:54:20,566

And like seeing his whole

creativity literally switch

:

00:54:20,566 --> 00:54:21,766

on a dime like within a week.

:

00:54:21,856 --> 00:54:22,216

Kathryn: Yeah.

:

00:54:22,336 --> 00:54:25,306

Tyler: And now he won't even

watch TV on his own accord because

:

00:54:25,306 --> 00:54:27,826

he knows, he doesn't like how

he feels when he watches tv.

:

00:54:27,946 --> 00:54:31,486

He'd rather be drawing, he'd rather be

outside playing somewhere, just like

:

00:54:31,486 --> 00:54:34,696

playing with a stick and making it a magic

wand and turning his sister into a duck.

:

00:54:34,936 --> 00:54:35,326

Like

:

00:54:35,776 --> 00:54:36,046

Kathryn: I love that.

:

00:54:36,526 --> 00:54:40,426

I haven't owned a TV in probably eight

years and Alan and I recently moved

:

00:54:40,426 --> 00:54:41,836

in together and we don't have a tv.

:

00:54:41,866 --> 00:54:41,956

Mm-hmm.

:

00:54:41,956 --> 00:54:45,846

And his son, Sterling has always been

someone that's used to that kind of thing.

:

00:54:45,846 --> 00:54:47,916

And he had a play, Sterling

had a PlayStation a while ago,

:

00:54:47,916 --> 00:54:49,116

which we've also gotten rid of.

:

00:54:49,116 --> 00:54:52,296

And our household saying is, when

Sterling says he's bored, we say, great.

:

00:54:52,296 --> 00:54:53,046

Whatcha gonna do about it?

:

00:54:53,166 --> 00:54:53,376

Right.

:

00:54:53,436 --> 00:54:55,686

And now, I mean, he's writing rap lyrics.

:

00:54:55,686 --> 00:54:57,516

He loves to draw all the time.

:

00:54:57,516 --> 00:54:58,926

He'll get on his bike and go fishing.

:

00:54:58,926 --> 00:55:01,416

Like that kid is so creative

and so smart, but it's through

:

00:55:01,416 --> 00:55:02,556

cultivating space for his board.

:

00:55:02,886 --> 00:55:03,246

Right.

:

00:55:03,486 --> 00:55:07,146

And as parents being okay

with the kid being bored.

:

00:55:07,151 --> 00:55:07,191

Bored.

:

00:55:07,191 --> 00:55:07,391

Yeah.

:

00:55:07,566 --> 00:55:07,836

Yeah.

:

00:55:07,896 --> 00:55:10,356

Tyler: Which means sometimes too,

especially with toddlers, like it

:

00:55:10,356 --> 00:55:11,706

means they are going to act up.

:

00:55:11,766 --> 00:55:11,976

Yes.

:

00:55:11,976 --> 00:55:14,466

Which means I get the opportunity

to actually be a parent.

:

00:55:14,526 --> 00:55:14,826

Yeah.

:

00:55:14,826 --> 00:55:18,876

And not just throw a screen in front of

them and just offload that responsibility.

:

00:55:18,876 --> 00:55:19,056

Well, and

:

00:55:19,056 --> 00:55:21,246

Kathryn: then self-regulate

too, as an individual.

:

00:55:21,246 --> 00:55:21,546

I was gonna

:

00:55:21,546 --> 00:55:24,216

Mike: say, you get to

show them self-regulation.

:

00:55:24,606 --> 00:55:24,666

Yeah.

:

00:55:24,666 --> 00:55:24,996

Right.

:

00:55:25,056 --> 00:55:25,656

Tyler: Exactly.

:

00:55:25,656 --> 00:55:29,226

Mike: Where you're, you're,

you're not mirroring their

:

00:55:29,766 --> 00:55:32,406

upsetness about the situation.

:

00:55:32,406 --> 00:55:33,246

You're like, well, that's okay.

:

00:55:33,846 --> 00:55:34,206

Right.

:

00:55:34,296 --> 00:55:37,596

It's okay that you're upset if you

do, you need to do, you need to be

:

00:55:37,596 --> 00:55:39,306

alone for a little while mm-hmm.

:

00:55:39,551 --> 00:55:40,716

To get to work through this.

:

00:55:40,716 --> 00:55:42,666

Kathryn: The saying you always say

with Shelby when she'd be upset,

:

00:55:43,176 --> 00:55:45,696

Mike: oh, you have, you, you

have the right to be angry.

:

00:55:45,696 --> 00:55:46,866

You don't have the right to be rude.

:

00:55:47,226 --> 00:55:47,376

Mm-hmm.

:

00:55:47,706 --> 00:55:48,756

I say that all the time.

:

00:55:48,761 --> 00:55:48,951

Mm-hmm.

:

00:55:49,031 --> 00:55:49,271

Right?

:

00:55:49,291 --> 00:55:49,711

Mm-hmm.

:

00:55:49,796 --> 00:55:51,246

You have the right to be confused.

:

00:55:51,246 --> 00:55:54,096

And especially like when she was

going into her teen years and,

:

00:55:54,576 --> 00:55:56,646

and, and changes that are going on.

:

00:55:56,646 --> 00:55:59,256

I'm like, you, you have the right

to have no idea what's going.

:

00:56:00,066 --> 00:56:01,206

You don't have the right to be it.

:

00:56:01,476 --> 00:56:01,686

Tyler: Beep.

:

00:56:02,496 --> 00:56:02,736

Kathryn: Yeah.

:

00:56:03,426 --> 00:56:04,716

I love how when it Shelby, he edits.

:

00:56:06,546 --> 00:56:08,106

Mike: That's the first

time I bleeped myself out.

:

00:56:09,876 --> 00:56:10,086

Alright,

:

00:56:10,986 --> 00:56:14,946

Chris: so I have two questions

for you to end up the podcast.

:

00:56:15,186 --> 00:56:16,896

First one, silly, second one, serious.

:

00:56:17,256 --> 00:56:22,086

So as a kid we were riding down

the street, sitting in the back of

:

00:56:22,086 --> 00:56:23,436

the car, no screens, no nothing.

:

00:56:23,706 --> 00:56:28,356

Did you look out and like imagine like

something running down the power lines or

:

00:56:28,356 --> 00:56:33,126

jumping across trees or did you just stare

out into the outdoors in the backseat?

:

00:56:33,366 --> 00:56:37,296

Mike: So I, I, I grew up in an

era where station wagons were

:

00:56:37,296 --> 00:56:39,246

popular and seat belts were not.

:

00:56:39,906 --> 00:56:43,856

So we, we had we had a

bunch of toys and things.

:

00:56:43,856 --> 00:56:45,626

My little brother was eight

years younger than me, which

:

00:56:45,656 --> 00:56:47,186

basically meant I ruled him.

:

00:56:47,996 --> 00:56:52,346

And but no, we would, we'd play,

they'd have games back there.

:

00:56:52,676 --> 00:56:56,426

You know, my dad had a pickup truck

that he ended up putting a cab on and.

:

00:56:57,236 --> 00:57:01,346

Carpeting the whole back with some benches

and we would crawl back there and, and go

:

00:57:01,346 --> 00:57:03,416

on, you know, on a road trip or whatever.

:

00:57:03,416 --> 00:57:08,156

So there, there was always like looking

at the countryside and counting cows or

:

00:57:08,516 --> 00:57:10,826

you know, doing, doing whatever like that.

:

00:57:10,826 --> 00:57:15,926

So, yeah, it was, it was just a going

on a road trip or doing that was so fun.

:

00:57:17,456 --> 00:57:18,986

Kathryn: I was always the co-pilot.

:

00:57:19,016 --> 00:57:22,076

'cause my mom, we always struck that she

could get lost in a Barbie doll paper bag.

:

00:57:22,436 --> 00:57:25,526

So I would have atlases out and like

Quest maps back when that was a thing.

:

00:57:25,526 --> 00:57:27,566

And I would always be calculating,

okay, in this mini mail.

:

00:57:27,566 --> 00:57:29,716

I was like what is Google Maps?

:

00:57:29,746 --> 00:57:29,896

Yeah.

:

00:57:29,896 --> 00:57:30,856

But what do we call Google Maps?

:

00:57:30,856 --> 00:57:31,546

I wanna say Siri.

:

00:57:31,546 --> 00:57:34,966

But like, I was, I was that for my mom

all the time of like, okay, in this many

:

00:57:34,966 --> 00:57:37,546

miles, based off of this math, we're

gonna be turning left on this street.

:

00:57:37,546 --> 00:57:39,256

So that, that was my

life in the cars again.

:

00:57:40,336 --> 00:57:40,426

Chris: Nice.

:

00:57:40,426 --> 00:57:43,246

Well, so the reason I asked that question

is 'cause we were talking about boredom.

:

00:57:43,396 --> 00:57:43,606

Yeah.

:

00:57:43,606 --> 00:57:46,036

And like, what do you do in that boredom?

:

00:57:46,036 --> 00:57:47,356

How do you fill that space?

:

00:57:47,416 --> 00:57:48,376

So that's why I was curious.

:

00:57:48,586 --> 00:57:50,236

Mike: I love filling the boredom space.

:

00:57:50,236 --> 00:57:51,826

I think it's the most creative I am.

:

00:57:52,036 --> 00:57:52,246

Mm-hmm.

:

00:57:52,491 --> 00:57:54,346

Is, is when you can sit.

:

00:57:55,141 --> 00:58:00,601

Quietly with your own thoughts or, or

even more important, try to eliminate

:

00:58:00,601 --> 00:58:02,941

thought through the the, yeah.

:

00:58:02,941 --> 00:58:05,551

I used to think prayer and

meditation were the same thing,

:

00:58:05,551 --> 00:58:06,421

and I don't think they are.

:

00:58:06,421 --> 00:58:06,511

Mm-hmm.

:

00:58:06,751 --> 00:58:08,821

I think prayer is active.

:

00:58:09,061 --> 00:58:09,151

Mm-hmm.

:

00:58:09,451 --> 00:58:13,471

It's, it's whoever your God is,

you know, for, for me, I'm a bible

:

00:58:13,471 --> 00:58:16,681

believing Christian for you, if it's

something different, if it's just the

:

00:58:16,681 --> 00:58:18,391

universe, if it's energy, that's all.

:

00:58:18,391 --> 00:58:18,751

Okay.

:

00:58:18,811 --> 00:58:19,171

Right.

:

00:58:19,231 --> 00:58:26,091

And but, but I think that's a

communication two way, right.

:

00:58:26,091 --> 00:58:28,851

You're, you're, you're going back

and forth, whereas meditation

:

00:58:28,851 --> 00:58:33,141

is a quieting of everything and,

and just seeing where it goes.

:

00:58:33,141 --> 00:58:37,371

And I, I've, I was, I, I have

pretty high energy overall.

:

00:58:37,371 --> 00:58:40,941

I, I, people joke, I don't, I,

I always say I don't idle well.

:

00:58:41,091 --> 00:58:41,331

Right.

:

00:58:41,361 --> 00:58:42,981

I, I wanna be in motion.

:

00:58:43,551 --> 00:58:46,281

I'm probably at a point in my life

where I feel the best I've ever

:

00:58:46,281 --> 00:58:49,311

felt and I actually idle well now.

:

00:58:50,751 --> 00:58:52,651

Kathryn: Mine is clear-minded meditation.

:

00:58:53,011 --> 00:58:58,201

I've done 500 hours worth of yoga training

in the last two years, and it took like

:

00:58:58,201 --> 00:58:59,671

almost a month in Costa Rica to find it.

:

00:58:59,671 --> 00:59:03,511

But of when I noticed that I've been

out in the world too much and that there

:

00:59:03,511 --> 00:59:06,721

is a lot of noise out the, out there,

like in my mind, I've just sitting

:

00:59:06,721 --> 00:59:10,021

in silence and then in my bag I've

switched from a purse to a backpack.

:

00:59:10,021 --> 00:59:10,861

I'm that person now.

:

00:59:11,041 --> 00:59:11,131

Mm-hmm.

:

00:59:11,371 --> 00:59:12,781

And I have adrenaline there.

:

00:59:12,781 --> 00:59:17,871

And then pot and jolly is a yoga sutras

and just I'm constantly studying,

:

00:59:17,871 --> 00:59:21,531

growing, like learning more about

the world and how I can evolve.

:

00:59:22,716 --> 00:59:24,486

Chris: So that leads to my next question.

:

00:59:24,996 --> 00:59:27,576

So it's been a while since

you've both been on the podcast.

:

00:59:27,786 --> 00:59:27,816

Mm.

:

00:59:28,026 --> 00:59:31,416

And we've talked about a lot today,

which kinda showcases like the

:

00:59:31,416 --> 00:59:35,196

transition in your mindset and the

growth that you guys have had pruning

:

00:59:35,196 --> 00:59:38,856

yourselves and just kinda like

adjusting and being something different.

:

00:59:39,166 --> 00:59:41,901

'Cause I can admit like you were two

very different people than you were

:

00:59:41,906 --> 00:59:43,426

the last time you were on the podcast.

:

00:59:43,426 --> 00:59:43,486

Yeah.

:

00:59:43,996 --> 00:59:47,596

And I say that in like, it's

not a good way or a bad way.

:

00:59:47,956 --> 00:59:48,316

Okay.

:

00:59:48,316 --> 00:59:49,246

No, it is a good way.

:

00:59:49,506 --> 00:59:49,686

Thank you.

:

00:59:49,686 --> 00:59:53,436

But just admitting that everyone is

different than the last time you saw them.

:

00:59:53,526 --> 00:59:53,736

Yeah.

:

00:59:53,766 --> 00:59:58,206

Like I think a lot of times, like you

mentioned, people picture the past

:

00:59:58,476 --> 01:00:02,736

and when you see somebody, you imagine

them as their previous iteration and

:

01:00:02,736 --> 01:00:04,266

not accepting that they're different.

:

01:00:04,856 --> 01:00:10,196

So then my question is now

like, what is your success?

:

01:00:10,376 --> 01:00:12,146

Like what do you view as success?

:

01:00:12,956 --> 01:00:14,216

Because I know it's definitely different

:

01:00:15,206 --> 01:00:16,076

Mike: ladies first.

:

01:00:18,611 --> 01:00:20,621

Kathryn: I don't focus on myself anymore.

:

01:00:20,711 --> 01:00:25,301

Like I focus on self-awareness and

trying to show up better in the world.

:

01:00:25,901 --> 01:00:29,681

Like before, I think that

I was more self-centered in

:

01:00:29,681 --> 01:00:31,451

regards of, does this look good?

:

01:00:31,481 --> 01:00:32,561

Can I fix this more?

:

01:00:32,561 --> 01:00:33,491

Can this be better?

:

01:00:33,731 --> 01:00:37,211

And now it's, can I be better for others?

:

01:00:37,271 --> 01:00:40,451

And I feel like I have so much

more responsibility in my life

:

01:00:40,451 --> 01:00:44,441

than I did before, and I'm actually

doing more than I've ever done.

:

01:00:45,161 --> 01:00:49,091

But I'm slow and intentional and

I have such an incredible partner

:

01:00:49,091 --> 01:00:52,001

that helps me to stay in that space.

:

01:00:52,001 --> 01:00:57,131

And I, my successes in the

simplicity of my happiness, I think,

:

01:00:59,231 --> 01:01:03,761

Mike: by the way, just us being

friends for years, I would echo that.

:

01:01:03,821 --> 01:01:09,781

And I think for me, I you

know, I don't compete against,

:

01:01:11,101 --> 01:01:12,871

I compete with my potential.

:

01:01:13,606 --> 01:01:17,776

Where I think, I think especially

growing up and, and Tyler, you

:

01:01:17,776 --> 01:01:20,806

and I have talked about our young

days in Pennsylvania mm-hmm.

:

01:01:21,346 --> 01:01:22,126

And that sort of stuff.

:

01:01:22,126 --> 01:01:24,706

It's just like, I have to

compete to get out of this.

:

01:01:24,736 --> 01:01:27,166

I have to compete to achieve this.

:

01:01:27,166 --> 01:01:30,286

I have to compete to like,

have this objective one.

:

01:01:30,316 --> 01:01:36,586

I, I think I enjoy the

journey more than I ever have.

:

01:01:36,586 --> 01:01:37,366

Kathryn: Mm-hmm.

:

01:01:37,426 --> 01:01:42,046

Mike: And my only competition is

going back to that redwood seed.

:

01:01:42,646 --> 01:01:50,176

It's like, am I, am I watering and

fertilizing and doing the things to my

:

01:01:50,176 --> 01:02:00,176

own God-given capabilities that I get to

realize those as opposed to, and, and also

:

01:02:00,176 --> 01:02:02,156

making sure I'm not pruning anybody else.

:

01:02:02,156 --> 01:02:02,246

Mm-hmm.

:

01:02:02,726 --> 01:02:04,916

Am I, am I helping fertilize other people?

:

01:02:04,976 --> 01:02:09,041

And sometimes going, going back

to that, the grace and truth.

:

01:02:09,956 --> 01:02:13,916

Is when you are, sometimes you're

making deposits into somebody

:

01:02:13,916 --> 01:02:16,346

else's account, that 99.9%

:

01:02:16,346 --> 01:02:18,056

of people that hear 'em

think it's a withdraw.

:

01:02:18,746 --> 01:02:19,946

But it's really a deposit.

:

01:02:19,946 --> 01:02:21,716

It's a deposit of I believe in you.

:

01:02:21,716 --> 01:02:22,406

Mm-hmm.

:

01:02:22,506 --> 01:02:25,806

Even if you don't believe in

yourself, I see the energy in you.

:

01:02:25,806 --> 01:02:27,006

I see the potential in you.

:

01:02:27,436 --> 01:02:32,326

And I, I think if, if anything, I've

probably gotten more candid since

:

01:02:32,326 --> 01:02:36,826

the last podcast with other people in

one-on-one and even group interactions.

:

01:02:37,281 --> 01:02:43,276

And, and I don't, I'm not competing

against, but I'm competing to be all

:

01:02:43,276 --> 01:02:45,586

that I feel like was put within me.

:

01:02:45,586 --> 01:02:45,646

So

:

01:02:46,396 --> 01:02:49,486

Kathryn: you guys are, you will insert

yourself sometimes, but not a lot of

:

01:02:49,486 --> 01:02:51,106

people ask you questions on the podcast.

:

01:02:51,106 --> 01:02:52,036

So, you know that's me.

:

01:02:52,066 --> 01:02:53,206

I always love to ask you guys questions.

:

01:02:53,416 --> 01:02:53,506

Yeah.

:

01:02:53,656 --> 01:02:56,446

So, to flip it back, I'm gonna

incorporate both of your questions and

:

01:02:56,446 --> 01:03:01,586

shoot it over to you guys of you both

seem happier and more rested than.

:

01:03:01,991 --> 01:03:05,171

The last time I saw you and you

clearly both are carrying a lot of

:

01:03:05,171 --> 01:03:08,891

joy in your hearts and your lives,

where do you guys find your rest?

:

01:03:08,891 --> 01:03:10,511

Where is your joy coming from right now?

:

01:03:12,401 --> 01:03:14,831

Tyler: I think kind of what Mike

was saying is I find a lot more

:

01:03:14,831 --> 01:03:16,961

joy in the journey than I used to.

:

01:03:17,111 --> 01:03:17,441

Kathryn: Yeah.

:

01:03:17,621 --> 01:03:19,841

Tyler: So there was always

me rushing to find something.

:

01:03:19,841 --> 01:03:22,661

Kind of like what you said to Catherine

is like, what are you running from?

:

01:03:22,751 --> 01:03:22,991

Yeah.

:

01:03:22,991 --> 01:03:26,801

I realized there was always something I

was running from, it was something I was

:

01:03:26,801 --> 01:03:28,841

trying to catch up to is what I thought.

:

01:03:28,991 --> 01:03:29,051

Yeah.

:

01:03:29,201 --> 01:03:30,671

I always thought there was something

in front of me and realized there

:

01:03:30,671 --> 01:03:36,161

was something behind me and realizing

that I had to make that switch and

:

01:03:36,161 --> 01:03:40,811

having more of that joy in the journey

is where a lot of this comes from.

:

01:03:40,891 --> 01:03:44,761

You guys coming back on now too,

this was the first time in three

:

01:03:44,761 --> 01:03:47,281

and a half years that we ever

took a break from the podcast.

:

01:03:47,791 --> 01:03:50,821

So we took about from the last one,

but probably close to two months.

:

01:03:50,821 --> 01:03:52,306

Kathryn: That's why you

guys look so rested, right?

:

01:03:52,306 --> 01:03:52,986

Yeah, exactly.

:

01:03:54,206 --> 01:03:54,426

Tyler: And.

:

01:03:55,786 --> 01:03:59,056

It got to the point where like, we

were building out the, the office

:

01:03:59,056 --> 01:04:02,056

and the studio and everything,

and I was just like, just trying

:

01:04:02,056 --> 01:04:03,496

to fill, fill, fill, fill, fill.

:

01:04:03,586 --> 01:04:05,506

And I realized I was also

doing that in life, right?

:

01:04:05,506 --> 01:04:07,756

It was like, Hey, there's,

where's this boredom coming from?

:

01:04:07,756 --> 01:04:08,386

I'm gonna fill it.

:

01:04:08,566 --> 01:04:08,806

Kathryn: Yep.

:

01:04:08,866 --> 01:04:08,986

And

:

01:04:08,986 --> 01:04:12,106

Tyler: it got to the point where I

wasn't being intentional with anything.

:

01:04:12,106 --> 01:04:15,346

I was just filling time and I, I saw

myself doing it with the podcast and when

:

01:04:15,346 --> 01:04:19,516

I finally stepped back and looked at that,

I go, shit, I was doing this with my life.

:

01:04:19,576 --> 01:04:19,996

Yeah.

:

01:04:20,056 --> 01:04:21,346

Like, I need to fix this too.

:

01:04:21,766 --> 01:04:25,276

So that, that's where a lot of the,

the joy comes from where I'm at now.

:

01:04:25,606 --> 01:04:27,466

Even with work with

family, with the podcast.

:

01:04:28,066 --> 01:04:28,186

I love

:

01:04:28,186 --> 01:04:28,276

Kathryn: that.

:

01:04:28,276 --> 01:04:28,786

That's awesome.

:

01:04:28,846 --> 01:04:29,386

Tell us Chris.

:

01:04:29,986 --> 01:04:32,001

Chris: Oh, my wrist is And Joy.

:

01:04:32,661 --> 01:04:32,881

Kathryn: Huh?

:

01:04:33,021 --> 01:04:33,736

Is it Enjoy.

:

01:04:34,036 --> 01:04:39,376

Chris: Oh, rest and joy is quite

literally just sitting now.

:

01:04:39,676 --> 01:04:43,996

So my wife asked of me to

like, build a back patio.

:

01:04:44,926 --> 01:04:49,996

I hated doing it in the moment because

one, I just despise doing things

:

01:04:49,996 --> 01:04:51,916

that I don't think I'll do perfectly.

:

01:04:52,276 --> 01:04:53,836

So we built it.

:

01:04:54,166 --> 01:04:54,886

I love it.

:

01:04:55,126 --> 01:04:58,966

But it's nice now that I can like

go out and like walk on my back area

:

01:04:59,386 --> 01:05:03,946

and like just listen to quiet and

the, the train running on the, the

:

01:05:03,946 --> 01:05:08,026

tracks behind our house, just like

understanding that I'm not in the city

:

01:05:08,446 --> 01:05:10,936

and I can just listen to quiet again.

:

01:05:10,936 --> 01:05:14,476

So then it kinda like rejuvenates

me instead of being at work.

:

01:05:14,806 --> 01:05:18,526

Which I love being at work with all

my friends and all my coworkers and

:

01:05:18,826 --> 01:05:22,906

like the pace, but then being able to

like go home and like put the phone

:

01:05:22,906 --> 01:05:25,816

down and be like, okay, it's quiet.

:

01:05:26,596 --> 01:05:27,886

Which one?

:

01:05:27,946 --> 01:05:31,816

I wish more cities would allow no more

apartments and just more houses so you can

:

01:05:31,816 --> 01:05:33,586

just sit back and like, look at this guy.

:

01:05:34,006 --> 01:05:37,306

Because we all just need to

like slow down a little bit.

:

01:05:38,296 --> 01:05:40,636

Kathryn: I feel like we've

all somehow hit the same page

:

01:05:40,636 --> 01:05:42,436

without ever speaking about it.

:

01:05:42,436 --> 01:05:46,636

And that maybe, hopefully the world is

kind of making that shift of steadily.

:

01:05:47,026 --> 01:05:47,476

Mike: Growth.

:

01:05:47,776 --> 01:05:47,986

Tyler: Yeah.

:

01:05:48,226 --> 01:05:48,496

Yeah.

:

01:05:48,866 --> 01:05:52,646

When I was in my undergrad in

operations, one of my professors

:

01:05:52,646 --> 01:05:55,016

said, we're going towards a point.

:

01:05:55,046 --> 01:05:58,856

This was before AI was a big thing where

technology was gonna take over and we're

:

01:05:58,856 --> 01:06:00,626

gonna be more consumed by technology.

:

01:06:00,926 --> 01:06:04,376

And he was like painting like

this nihilistic type of future.

:

01:06:04,766 --> 01:06:06,536

And then he was doing it on purpose.

:

01:06:06,536 --> 01:06:09,026

He was painting this like nihilistic

future of where we would be.

:

01:06:09,266 --> 01:06:12,806

And he goes, but I have more faith in

humanity than that and there's gonna be

:

01:06:12,806 --> 01:06:14,396

a straw that breaks this camel's back.

:

01:06:14,756 --> 01:06:17,666

And we're gonna start going back

to realizing what's more important.

:

01:06:17,936 --> 01:06:20,876

And I think for a lot of people, at least

the people that we surround ourselves

:

01:06:20,876 --> 01:06:22,216

with I think we've realized that.

:

01:06:24,151 --> 01:06:24,496

Chris: Do you

:

01:06:24,496 --> 01:06:24,556

Tyler: have

:

01:06:24,556 --> 01:06:24,706

Chris: any

:

01:06:24,706 --> 01:06:25,426

Tyler: final questions?

:

01:06:26,236 --> 01:06:26,986

Take it away, Chris.

:

01:06:27,586 --> 01:06:29,266

Chris: So do you guys

wanna shout out anything?

:

01:06:29,266 --> 01:06:32,116

I know you're not really on social

media, but anything going on in

:

01:06:32,116 --> 01:06:34,516

your life that you wanna be like,

Hey, you guys keep an eye out.

:

01:06:34,966 --> 01:06:35,716

Anything for you?

:

01:06:35,716 --> 01:06:36,736

Any fun trips?

:

01:06:36,741 --> 01:06:36,971

Okay.

:

01:06:37,951 --> 01:06:41,251

Mike: I've got a wedding in Mexico for

some great friends next month, but Nice.

:

01:06:41,251 --> 01:06:42,121

No real shout outs.

:

01:06:42,121 --> 01:06:45,761

I am working on a book actually

that we talked about earlier that I

:

01:06:45,761 --> 01:06:47,531

hope to have out next year sometime.

:

01:06:47,536 --> 01:06:47,586

Nice.

:

01:06:47,621 --> 01:06:48,041

Nice.

:

01:06:48,041 --> 01:06:51,251

I've got one on Amazon now

called Impactful Development.

:

01:06:51,251 --> 01:06:55,421

Essentially it's how to help solve the

country's affordable housing crisis.

:

01:06:55,451 --> 01:06:55,631

Mm-hmm.

:

01:06:55,851 --> 01:07:00,911

From that perspective, which is a passion,

but but the one I'm working on is the, the

:

01:07:00,911 --> 01:07:07,361

moment of decision and, and it's really

a, hopefully what will become a impactful

:

01:07:07,361 --> 01:07:14,831

personal development and reflection along

with explaining and charting David's life

:

01:07:14,836 --> 01:07:19,961

and how to learn from those experiences

and how many moments of decision we

:

01:07:19,961 --> 01:07:25,121

have and how to process those and

look back and go, wow, that was, yeah.

:

01:07:25,271 --> 01:07:27,251

Really the right path

I should have been on.

:

01:07:27,251 --> 01:07:27,521

I like that.

:

01:07:28,401 --> 01:07:31,041

Kathryn: Work-wise, I've switched

over to the design side of real

:

01:07:31,041 --> 01:07:32,331

estate, which is where I started.

:

01:07:32,331 --> 01:07:33,831

The whole reason I got my

real estate license mm-hmm.

:

01:07:34,071 --> 01:07:34,526

Was from flipping and now.

:

01:07:35,136 --> 01:07:37,386

I'm on the building side, which is

a whole other animal, but I love it.

:

01:07:37,416 --> 01:07:37,656

Yeah.

:

01:07:38,031 --> 01:07:41,286

Because I'm like in that creative

space and it's just, it's the

:

01:07:41,286 --> 01:07:42,366

home I was meant to be in.

:

01:07:42,366 --> 01:07:45,066

But because of that, I'm not really

on the client side of things now,

:

01:07:45,066 --> 01:07:48,736

but one of the hobbies I've picked

up is I teach yoga over at Emotion.

:

01:07:48,736 --> 01:07:50,086

So if I'm gonna shout

out to anybody Oh, nice.

:

01:07:50,116 --> 01:07:51,706

It's gonna be for emotion.

:

01:07:51,706 --> 01:07:55,516

I'm actually gonna start teaching the five

ams for on Tuesdays starting next month.

:

01:07:55,516 --> 01:07:57,366

But right now I just teach Monday at noon.

:

01:07:57,366 --> 01:07:59,916

But like, that is like my weekly church.

:

01:07:59,916 --> 01:08:05,166

Like that is my home, my grounding space,

my way of staying in this like calm.

:

01:08:05,166 --> 01:08:07,416

So if you haven't been to emotion,

that's, that's what I'm shouting at.

:

01:08:07,416 --> 01:08:07,746

That's an

:

01:08:07,746 --> 01:08:08,466

Mike: awesome spot.

:

01:08:08,466 --> 01:08:09,966

And that's how we became friends.

:

01:08:09,966 --> 01:08:10,626

Yeah.

:

01:08:10,626 --> 01:08:10,636

Yeah.

:

01:08:10,981 --> 01:08:14,421

Kathryn: It was honestly we were,

we met at a bar, but we you were a

:

01:08:14,421 --> 01:08:15,121

mutual friend through a mutual friend.

:

01:08:15,296 --> 01:08:16,161

Yeah, yeah.

:

01:08:16,191 --> 01:08:16,761

Clarify.

:

01:08:17,151 --> 01:08:23,201

But I was on 75 hard when we met, and he

had actually done 75 hard and he was like,

:

01:08:23,201 --> 01:08:24,941

Hey, let's go to a 5:00 AM yoga class.

:

01:08:24,941 --> 01:08:26,201

I was like, I do yoga, this is great.

:

01:08:26,381 --> 01:08:28,751

And I took Macy Cole's 5:00 AM yoga class.

:

01:08:28,751 --> 01:08:28,841

Mm-hmm.

:

01:08:29,741 --> 01:08:31,781

And they were speaking Sanskrit and a

whole, their language, doing crazy stuff.

:

01:08:31,781 --> 01:08:35,261

Everybody's in like chin stand and K and I

didn't know what any of those words meant.

:

01:08:35,261 --> 01:08:35,621

Still Don.

:

01:08:35,741 --> 01:08:36,731

And yeah.

:

01:08:36,731 --> 01:08:40,520

And now I live, I definitely know I

live there, but travel wise leaving for

:

01:08:40,520 --> 01:08:43,871

Europe in a week and a half and then

taking Alan to Bermuda for his birthday.

:

01:08:43,991 --> 01:08:44,441

Tyler: Oh, nice.

:

01:08:44,470 --> 01:08:44,831

That's awesome.

:

01:08:44,831 --> 01:08:45,611

Does he know about that?

:

01:08:45,731 --> 01:08:46,001

Yes.

:

01:08:46,001 --> 01:08:46,631

That's why I said it.

:

01:08:48,431 --> 01:08:49,931

Chris: He'll be out after

his birthday probably.

:

01:08:49,931 --> 01:08:50,321

Yeah.

:

01:08:50,591 --> 01:08:51,161

I love that.

:

01:08:51,431 --> 01:08:53,981

I'm a, I like to see where people travel.

:

01:08:54,371 --> 01:08:57,761

One, I have a, a travel list running

through my head and then I'm always

:

01:08:57,761 --> 01:08:59,681

like, oh, well this seems interesting.

:

01:09:00,611 --> 01:09:02,111

Kathryn: So we were supposed

to go to Mexico with them, but

:

01:09:02,111 --> 01:09:03,161

then our year trip got moved.

:

01:09:03,461 --> 01:09:03,821

Got you.

:

01:09:04,060 --> 01:09:04,301

Yeah.

:

01:09:04,666 --> 01:09:05,236

Chris: That there was.

:

01:09:06,341 --> 01:09:10,871

That's the one thing I like about social

media is seeing where people went and like

:

01:09:11,231 --> 01:09:12,821

their perspective while they were there.

:

01:09:13,241 --> 01:09:16,331

Because like me and my wife are very

history focused and a lot of people

:

01:09:16,331 --> 01:09:17,861

are just like aesthetic focused.

:

01:09:18,491 --> 01:09:20,651

So it's when you stop posting,

:

01:09:20,651 --> 01:09:22,631

Kathryn: it's crazy where you

wanna go and what you wanna do.

:

01:09:23,111 --> 01:09:23,261

Chris: Yeah.

:

01:09:23,651 --> 01:09:23,770

Cool.

:

01:09:24,431 --> 01:09:26,051

Well, thank you guys.

:

01:09:26,051 --> 01:09:26,171

Great.

:

01:09:26,441 --> 01:09:26,890

Mike: Thank you.

:

01:09:27,371 --> 01:09:30,881

Chris: We will catch you in the next

one, like, comment, share, subscribe.

:

01:09:31,100 --> 01:09:32,241

And if you're not Tyler,

:

01:09:35,571 --> 01:09:37,131

Kathryn: are you just gonna add

like, a cool closure in here

:

01:09:37,131 --> 01:09:37,850

since everybody's getting up?

:

01:09:37,941 --> 01:09:38,720

Everyone's running

:

01:09:38,720 --> 01:09:39,171

Chris: away.

:

01:09:39,376 --> 01:09:41,991

I, I promise I did not

pass gas or anything.

:

01:09:42,281 --> 01:09:46,520

But yeah, like, comment, share,

subscribe and comment down

:

01:09:46,520 --> 01:09:48,591

below or in the IG caption.

:

01:09:48,781 --> 01:09:51,781

What has been your favorite topic today?

:

01:09:51,816 --> 01:09:54,241

Do, do you, did you

know about Bonsai trees?

:

01:09:54,661 --> 01:09:57,811

Kathryn: I've heard Mike's story before

and like once I understood that, it

:

01:09:57,871 --> 01:09:59,431

clicked in my mind of like, oh my God.

:

01:09:59,611 --> 01:10:03,301

Like what am I doing in my life where I'm

missing out on my full redwood potential?

:

01:10:03,301 --> 01:10:04,266

See, yeah, see

:

01:10:04,706 --> 01:10:05,706

Chris: learning something new every day.

:

01:10:05,706 --> 01:10:05,986

Mm-hmm.

:

01:10:06,601 --> 01:10:06,811

Yeah.

:

01:10:07,021 --> 01:10:07,441

Peace.

:

01:10:08,131 --> 01:10:08,371

Bye.

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Whiskey & Wisdom
Talking about life over a glass of whiskey
Discussing life's most fascinating topics over a good glass of whiskey.
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Tyler Yaw